Natural Breast Enhancement Forums

Hi lostacres6,

My new program looks like this:
a.m. maca root flour in water, < 3,000 mg and phasing out
3 times a day tea from 1,500 mg dried chopped goat's rue
noon powdered fenugreek seed in water < 3,000 mg
noon black seed < 3,000 mg
p.m. porridge: dried hops flowers < 3,000 mg, broken flax seed < 3,000 mg, oat flakes 10,000 mg, honey, milk, raisins and some sweetened breakfast cereals
p.m. multi-vitamin in water:
vitamin B6 2-10 mg
vitamin B12 50-80 µg
zinc 12-35 mg
folic acid 200-400 µg
no iron (menstruating women need 25 mg)

The hops and the flax are the phyto-estrogens. The maca improves mood and libido, to counter the negative effects of the hops. The hops also keeps DHT low. Fenugreek, goat's rue, and black seed increase prolactin to cause swelling, and improve insulin sensitivity to slim the waist. Fenugreek also increases progesterone, to prevent estrogen dominance. Flax increases Sex Hormone Binding Globulin, but I take more oats to decrease it again. Oats is also a source of zinc, vitamin B6, and silicic acid. Silicic acid is necessary to make collagen from amino acids, which I get from meat, eggs, and cheese. One of my books says silicic acid is mainly in oat straw, not oat tops or flakes, still gotta check that out. Vitamin B6, B12, zinc, maca, and fenugreek put on weight, black seed decreases weight. Lettuce and the folic acid in the multivitamin replace the beremeal in Eve M's program as sources of folates. The honey and raisins are because I avoid sugar, to keep insulin low. I avoid stress and heavy exercise to keep cortisol low.

If you want to save time, try Eve M's program, because that includes three phyto-estrogens (hops, flax, soy) at lower doses (800-1,800 mg). Hops started working for me five years ago, so I just stick to hops and have added flax as an experiment. I can always try soy later. Once you have tested a phyto-estrogen for four months with no results, try another one. You probably just don't have the intestinal bacteria to digest that particular phyto-estrogen to its more active estrogenic metabolite.

Mood swings are a normal side effect of estrogens and phyto-estrogens. They are a sign that the estrogens are working, yes. I take them at night, so the mood swing occurs while I'm sleeping, and because hops makes me sleepy. I take maca in the morning, but I want to phase that out because it increases testosterone, and I have a feeling that lowers LH and consequently decreases all sex hormones including estrogens. After phasing out maca, I will try oats in the morning if I'm still moody at daybreak. The vitamin B6 in oats is a sedative above 10 mg, but my oat flakes only contains 0.33 mg vitamin B6 per 100 g flakes.

Wahaika recommended borage (starflower) oil to maca users, at the bottom of this archived thread:
http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=11437
The GLA in borage oil increases aromatase.

xxd listed alternatives to increase aromatase here:
http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=11239&pid=45711#pid45711

I don't think aromatase is the issue. Most people have enough of it. The problem is that the anterior pituitary gland tries to keep the total amount of sex hormones constant. So if maca, as a nutrient, tries to increase sex hormones, it's a lost cause. And the best thing an aromatase booster can do is slightly decrease testosterone, so estrogens can be higher. But I expect the effect will be marginal. An anti-androgen would be more effective, because it drives DHT to zero, which makes more room for estrogens in the constant total amount of sex hormones.

I used to think maca is a workaround for stalling, because some gray literature says it increases DHEA. But if it does, it will increase the production of pregnenolone from cholesterol as well, which is exactly the point where Luteinizing Hormone will put the brake on when the total amount of sex steroids becomes too high.

Hi Isabelle,

How is everything

Well been reading the site but not posting and been with my man on and off..just got home from being with him since Tues. Well as for my progress havent been on herbs for a month now.. just taking some supps.. trying to clean up my diet..eating to many sugary things but not that bad and for some reason it doesnt effect my sugar lately weird.. I will be going to the doc in a few weeks just to see how my blood levels are hormones, thyroid, nutrients etc... I but my lower back out about 2 weeks ago when I was at my mans ..I wanted to do a certain "exercise" and he said your hips are going to hurt..well as usual he was right and 2 days later it was wicked killing me..dont understand why cause I did that "exercise" before and just hurt a little..anyway I went to the ER the other day and the one thing that helps the most is muscle relaxers... I think I have a muscle spasm cause if I move a certain way it gives me a jult..get this though when me and my man are together it doesnt hurt at all and it feels better..anyway back to my titas they are getting bigger..the weird thing is I felt I gained weight and that is why which it is but today I weighted myself thinking I gained like 5 lbs and I didnt gain a thing..someone said I looked bigger in the titas..maybe it is just being happy and less stress..ok time to get ready for bed..talk tomorrow.. I forgot to mention to ask you a question about a product called biosil..it is a form of silica.. I read alot of reviews on it that alot have had good results for the joints and bones, skin (wrinkles), and making hair grow faster, stronger, shiney and overall healthy..they all say the liquid gives the best results.. I wonder what it would do for the titas and booty make them firmer I am going to buy some next month..

Cool Isabelle, I am also trying out nigella sativa. I think we're on to something.

Also, will you ever post your final progress once you have achieved your desired results? I would love to see them.

I have decided to only post final happy results if there is a noticeable difference in cup size - no more constant snapping and looking for growth month to month. Like the frequent tape measuring, it drives me bananas!

Hi Susan,

If it's muscles, try a hot bath. Works for me.

Biosil is a silicic acid supplement. You need silicic acid to make collagen from aminoacids, and it indeed helps hair growth. I only get silicic acid from oat flakes now, if at all, because most of the silicic acid seems to be in the oat straw, rather than in the tops. Other silicic acid supplements and foods are horse tail, millet, and apple cores. You can actually taste it: horse tail, as a plant, tastes like apple core.

Hi Princess,

Interested to know how your black seed experiment goes. About the final result: I really don't get along well with a camera, and I hate to ask my younger daughter to put my breasts on the web. But anyway, it will be a while. Still sobbing about my lost cup sizes. Two weeks ago, I had this curvaceous she-male body, and now all I have is... a six pack. This is sooo not what I was doing this for! I think I'll keep the maca dose lower than ever for now.

I don't take pictures, I don't have a measuring bra, and I keep the tape in my hand bag. Somehow, that keeps me from whipping it out more than once every two weeks, on my scheduled tape day.

I can relate! When is this permanent!

I would love to have reached that D size you have been lucky to get. But I can imagine any loss is no good no matter how far you've gotten in NBE. I would still be pleased with a full B cup though.
I don't mind a little maintenance dose everyday but heaven forbid I am away from my supplements for a bit and lose what I've worked so hard for all these years off and on. This is the very reason why I don't like pumping everyday. I hate the deflate after 3 weeks have passed of not doing it.

I will never give up though. Anastasia's words are stuck with me on this.


I'll let you know if it works for me.

Haha, thank you, Princess,

I don't think I'll ever give up, either. I'm working towards a maintenance program that will improve my life anyway. I like goat's rue tea better than supermarket teabags that taste like paper. And I like oat flakes a lot better than sweetened breakfast cereals. It's like coming up with more and more lifestyle changes that are hormone friendly

Hi Isabelle,
Just curious as to why you chose Hops over PM. PM is supposed to be the "ultimate" phytoestrogen, correct? I am starting my 4th mo on PM & will reconsider going to Hops after next month if I don't see any growth. Also, Eve M uses Hops in her booby batter (along with oats, soy & borage oil). In your opinion, will this mixture be absorbed into the skin & cause growth?
I "trust YOUR instincts"
Thanks & have a great day.

Hi lostacres6,

I linked a book here that reports equal potency for hops and PM:
http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=8419&pid=36162#pid36162

Other than that, I have good reasons not to use PM:
1. PM is illegal in EU.
2. Hops worked for me before.
3. PM increases dopamine, and makes people euphoric.
4. The withdrawal effects of PM are serious.
5. There is less safety literature on PM than on hops, flax, and soy.
6. PM suppresses prolactin.
7. I can check the quality of hops in the shop, PM is just wait what you get.
8. Because PM messes up periods in women, I'm afraid it will decrease LH.
9. Hops has been used by Belgian trannies for at least 200 years.
10. Hops has sufficient anti-androgen, PM may require SP for 6 months.
11. There is enough info on how much FG to take with hops, PM gives people headaches.
12. PM can be seized at customs.
13. There is no traditional use of PM for men in Thailand.
14. PM is more expensive than hops.
15. Eve M's program has a lot of handles to tweak it, PM is fixed.
16. I can go back to the shop if the hops turns out to be poor quality.
17. There are enough people using PM on the male forum.
18. I like the vivid dreams from hops.

I don't use hops as a topical, because it needs digestion to increase the phyto-estrogen content. Without digestion, it's an anti-androgen.

Hi Isabelle

I can't argue with some of your reasons, even though I don't necessarily support all of them, however I'd be interested in knowing why you make the following statements:


Other than that, I have good reasons not to use PM:
1. PM is illegal in EU. Since when? If thats true, how come there are EU based importers/retailers? I'm thinking of Ainterol.eu based in Germany and Pueraria.co.uk, based in UK, to name but 2 ?
3. PM increases dopamine, and makes people euphoric. It may or may not, certainly I've never found that and just recently I've found a growing craving for chocolate( which so far I've resisted!).

11. PM gives people headaches. You left out the fact that this is prevalent at very high doses and any sort of E dominance can have that effect.
12. PM can be seized at customs. Refer to (1) I've never heard of that happening?