[pom19]

Hannah, either stop the PM or at least decrease it. POM

[hannah]

Hannah, either stop the PM or at least decrease it. POM

Thank you Pom, I'll keep it in eye. I'll continue for at least 2 weeks and see how it goes.

[pom19]

Hannah, either stop the PM or at least decrease it. POM

Thank you Pom, I'll keep it in eye. I'll continue for at least 2 weeks and see how it goes.

----------------------------------
And above all guard your mind & body. <3

[hannah]

Good article about pueraria mirifica:

http://yestheyrenatural.com/how-to-get-b...ate-guide/

[hannah]

Interesting this..about P.

''Your breasts needs progesterone as well as estrogen to grow. It is progesterone that activates estrogen receptors so that estrogen can bind to them. Progesterone is also the hormone responsible for building up fat stores in the breast.''

[pom19]

Interesting this..about P.

''Your breasts needs progesterone as well as estrogen to grow. It is progesterone that activates estrogen receptors so that estrogen can bind to them. Progesterone is also the hormone responsible for building up fat stores in the breast.''

---------------------------------------------------
Yes, and many people do not know the importance of progesterone .

[EllaC]

It's funny how boobs always get bigger during the high progesterone phase. Testament to the relevance of progesterone right although I know there's more behind luteal phase like water retention etc

[Lotus]

Interesting this..about P.

''Your breasts needs progesterone as well as estrogen to grow. It is progesterone that activates estrogen receptors so that estrogen can bind to them. Progesterone is also the hormone responsible for building up fat stores in the breast.''

Absolutely true, the combined therapy is like a bio-directional response, for instance free T (the bio-active T) decreases by two-fold by the combined E and progesterone.

The effect of combined oral contraception on testosterone levels in healthy women: a systematic review and meta-analysis.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24082040

The current literature review and meta-analysis demonstrates that COCs decrease circulating levels of total T and free T and increase SBHG concentrations. Due to the SHBG increase, free T levels decrease twice as much as total T. The estrogen dose and progestin type of the COC do not influence the decline of total and free T, but both affect SHBG. The clinical implications of suppressed androgen levels during COC use remain to be elucidated.

Another similar study states a higher result from staggering dosages (orally). Imo this suggests a cyclic approach to lower androgens. Which btw androstenedione is the androgen culprit in GG's........not DHT.

contraceptives containing ethinylestradiol and gestodene or norgestimate upon androgen parameters and serum binding proteins.

Abstract
The effect of a triphasic oral contraceptive containing ethinylestradiol and gestodene (EE/GSD) on various serum hormonal parameters was compared with that of a monophasic formulation containing 35 micrograms ethinylestradiol and 250 micrograms norgestimate (EE/NGM). Blood samples were collected from 46 women on days 2, 11, and 21 of the preceding control cycle and of the third, sixth and twelfth treatment cycle. There was no significant difference in the influence on any hormonal parameter between both formulations. Both EE/GSD and EE/NGM caused a time-dependent suppression of serum dehydroepiandrosterone sulphate (DHEA-S) by 20-30% (p < 0.01) and a reduction of 5 alpha-androstane-3 alpha, 17 beta-diol glucuronide by 50-60% (p < 0.01) during each treatment cycle, while androstenedione levels were reduced by 25% (p < 0.01). There was also a significant decrease in the levels of total testosterone by 30-35% (p < 0.01) and free testosterone by 60% (p < 0.01), while sex hormone-binding globulin (SHBG) was increased by 200-240% on days 11 and 21 (p < 0.01). During the pill-free interval the SHBG levels were reduced to a certain degree but remained elevated by 100% as compared to the pretreatment values. The serum levels of corticosteroid-binding globulin (CBG) which is known to be influenced only by the estrogenic component of combination pills, increased significantly by 170% (p < 0.01) during each treatment cycle. During the pill-free interval of 7 days, the CBG levels decreased but were still elevated by 90-100% as compared to the control cycle. Similarly, the serum levels of cortisol were significantly elevated by 110-140% (p < 0.01) during treatment with both preparations. The results demonstrate a profound suppression of androgen levels and peripheral androgen metabolism.

I think we just busted the freaking door wide open.

[hannah]

Interesting this..about P.

''Your breasts needs progesterone as well as estrogen to grow. It is progesterone that activates estrogen receptors so that estrogen can bind to them. Progesterone is also the hormone responsible for building up fat stores in the breast.''

Absolutely true, the combined therapy is like a bio-directional response, for instance free T (the bio-active T) decreases by two-fold by the combined E and progesterone.

The effect of combined oral contraception on testosterone levels in healthy women: a systematic review and meta-analysis.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24082040

The current literature review and meta-analysis demonstrates that COCs decrease circulating levels of total T and free T and increase SBHG concentrations. Due to the SHBG increase, free T levels decrease twice as much as total T. The estrogen dose and progestin type of the COC do not influence the decline of total and free T, but both affect SHBG. The clinical implications of suppressed androgen levels during COC use remain to be elucidated.

Another similar study states a higher result from staggering dosages (orally). Imo this suggests a cyclic approach to lower androgens. Which btw androstenedione is the androgen culprit in GG's........not DHT.

contraceptives containing ethinylestradiol and gestodene or norgestimate upon androgen parameters and serum binding proteins.

Abstract
The effect of a triphasic oral contraceptive containing ethinylestradiol and gestodene (EE/GSD) on various serum hormonal parameters was compared with that of a monophasic formulation containing 35 micrograms ethinylestradiol and 250 micrograms norgestimate (EE/NGM). Blood samples were collected from 46 women on days 2, 11, and 21 of the preceding control cycle and of the third, sixth and twelfth treatment cycle. There was no significant difference in the influence on any hormonal parameter between both formulations. Both EE/GSD and EE/NGM caused a time-dependent suppression of serum dehydroepiandrosterone sulphate (DHEA-S) by 20-30% (p < 0.01) and a reduction of 5 alpha-androstane-3 alpha, 17 beta-diol glucuronide by 50-60% (p < 0.01) during each treatment cycle, while androstenedione levels were reduced by 25% (p < 0.01). There was also a significant decrease in the levels of total testosterone by 30-35% (p < 0.01) and free testosterone by 60% (p < 0.01), while sex hormone-binding globulin (SHBG) was increased by 200-240% on days 11 and 21 (p < 0.01). During the pill-free interval the SHBG levels were reduced to a certain degree but remained elevated by 100% as compared to the pretreatment values. The serum levels of corticosteroid-binding globulin (CBG) which is known to be influenced only by the estrogenic component of combination pills, increased significantly by 170% (p < 0.01) during each treatment cycle. During the pill-free interval of 7 days, the CBG levels decreased but were still elevated by 90-100% as compared to the control cycle. Similarly, the serum levels of cortisol were significantly elevated by 110-140% (p < 0.01) during treatment with both preparations. The results demonstrate a profound suppression of androgen levels and peripheral androgen metabolism.

I think we just busted the freaking door wide open.

Thank you Lotus, thats some great additional info. Ha ha that door better be open and stays open..then all we have to do is walk out of there with our bigger boobs:p

Are you btw aware of the essential(but rare)mineral Boron/borium? It can help us a lot, its an good/if not essential add to vit D. Helpful for calcium/magnesium metabolism and also plays a role in our hormonal housekeeping, namely testosteron and estrogen.(also helps body with forming estrogen)
I started taking it for my jaw, but appaerently it has many more benefits as well for NBE.

[Lotus]

Interesting this..about P.

''Your breasts needs progesterone as well as estrogen to grow. It is progesterone that activates estrogen receptors so that estrogen can bind to them. Progesterone is also the hormone responsible for building up fat stores in the breast.''

Absolutely true, the combined therapy is like a bio-directional response, for instance free T (the bio-active T) decreases by two-fold by the combined E and progesterone.

The effect of combined oral contraception on testosterone levels in healthy women: a systematic review and meta-analysis.
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24082040

The current literature review and meta-analysis demonstrates that COCs decrease circulating levels of total T and free T and increase SBHG concentrations. Due to the SHBG increase, free T levels decrease twice as much as total T. The estrogen dose and progestin type of the COC do not influence the decline of total and free T, but both affect SHBG. The clinical implications of suppressed androgen levels during COC use remain to be elucidated.

Another similar study states a higher result from staggering dosages (orally). Imo this suggests a cyclic approach to lower androgens. Which btw androstenedione is the androgen culprit in GG's........not DHT.

contraceptives containing ethinylestradiol and gestodene or norgestimate upon androgen parameters and serum binding proteins.

Abstract
The effect of a triphasic oral contraceptive containing ethinylestradiol and gestodene (EE/GSD) on various serum hormonal parameters was compared with that of a monophasic formulation containing 35 micrograms ethinylestradiol and 250 micrograms norgestimate (EE/NGM). Blood samples were collected from 46 women on days 2, 11, and 21 of the preceding control cycle and of the third, sixth and twelfth treatment cycle. There was no significant difference in the influence on any hormonal parameter between both formulations. Both EE/GSD and EE/NGM caused a time-dependent suppression of serum dehydroepiandrosterone sulphate (DHEA-S) by 20-30% (p < 0.01) and a reduction of 5 alpha-androstane-3 alpha, 17 beta-diol glucuronide by 50-60% (p < 0.01) during each treatment cycle, while androstenedione levels were reduced by 25% (p < 0.01). There was also a significant decrease in the levels of total testosterone by 30-35% (p < 0.01) and free testosterone by 60% (p < 0.01), while sex hormone-binding globulin (SHBG) was increased by 200-240% on days 11 and 21 (p < 0.01). During the pill-free interval the SHBG levels were reduced to a certain degree but remained elevated by 100% as compared to the pretreatment values. The serum levels of corticosteroid-binding globulin (CBG) which is known to be influenced only by the estrogenic component of combination pills, increased significantly by 170% (p < 0.01) during each treatment cycle. During the pill-free interval of 7 days, the CBG levels decreased but were still elevated by 90-100% as compared to the control cycle. Similarly, the serum levels of cortisol were significantly elevated by 110-140% (p < 0.01) during treatment with both preparations. The results demonstrate a profound suppression of androgen levels and peripheral androgen metabolism.

I think we just busted the freaking door wide open.

Thank you Lotus, thats some great additional info. Ha ha that door better be open and stays open..then all we have to do is walk out of there with our bigger boobs:p

Are you btw aware of the essential(but rare)mineral Boron/borium? It can help us a lot, its an good/if not essential add to vit D. Helpful for calcium/magnesium metabolism and also plays a role in our hormonal housekeeping, namely testosteron and estrogen.(also helps body with forming estrogen)
I started taking it for my jaw, but appaerently it has many more benefits as well for NBE.

Hi Hannah,

Yes, I do remember boron, Peggy has a thread with great info on boron/borax. This idea about using a triphasic phase approach would tie in to the 21 day cycle plan.

I'm not suggesting using (pharma) synthetics on this approach, it would involve a couple nbe staples (coconut oil/green tea) and a few other things. No crazy ideas of 4x the recommended amount, we don't need anyone to develop hypoglycemic shock or develop a toxic liver.