[grace]

Personally I was very upset to see all of Majestic's posts. I viewed them as unkind and judgmental. However, as much as I do not like her views, I have no control over them. I don't think that she should have to leave the site though. If we are just as judgmental toward her views as she has been toward ours, then we are all only being close minded. She has a right to her opinion just as we all do. Calling her ignorant and a moron isn't accomplishing anything, in fact it is just feeding a cycle of intolerance.
I believe people should go about expressing their beliefs in a more peaceful and respectful manner.
That's just my opinion, I'm not trying to offend anyone.

[Nessa]

i totally understand what you say Grace, she has the right to think differently, and to impose our point of view is wrong, but sadly as wahaika pointed out, this is not a democracy, EVE rules, and what she says it gets done, i know that there most be a lot of people on this forum that agree in some parts with Majestic´s POV but they dont speak because theyre afraid, or maybe are a minority,i don´t know,but we want prejudiced people out of the forum, because theyre doing damage to our ``society´´ shes committing abuse against our members, and claiming that people with real results are not, just like in real life, if you damge your society, they take you out of it, and into jail, if someones damages this forum, we don´t want them in it, but that doesn´t mean she has to leave the forum, this is a mere poll, to know what does the majority preferse, it doesn´t means that EVE is gonna take that into account.

[Bibi]

Grace I understand what you´re getting at, and I agree that this could be interpreted as another sort of intolerance, but there is always a fine line in these matters that you have to take into account. When you say that intolerance is not accepted, this could be taken to mean that you have to be tolerant of any other people´s views, even if they are being intolerant. But this is a very dangerous train of thought, because then that would mean that movements like for instance the nazis would have to be legalized, because after all their´s is just another point of view, right? So if someone was to found a nazi political party they would be allowed to do that. And then it would be impossible to prohibit their activity in harming other human beings.
So I think in this case there is a similarity, because even if we´re just writing our opinions and no one is going to send men with boobs to the gas chambers or whatever, it breeds an atmosphere that can ultimately be very harmful for others. If the opinion that others can be banned because they´re "different" is accepted, then the violent bullies will feel entitled to give them a beating for instance.
And even if this doesn´t happen - which only a very optimistic person would think - being called a freak or a pervert is just very painful, even if it is done in an anonymous forum.

[Anastasia916]

Grace, we understand where you are getting at, but I have to agree with the arguments Nessa and Bibi set forth. I call her a moron and ignorant because I call ALL prejudiced people that! Someone who would judge someone for the color of their skin, their beliefs, their gender (this includes TG's!), their sexuality, etc. are ignorant, and like I said to Wahaika, I feel sorry for the closed minded, ignorant, prejudiced people. Some of the best friends I've made that added sooo much positivity, life lessons, etc. are those that are torn down and judged by others because of one thing or another. What these ignorant people are, are blind. Blind to see what is good and right in front of them. But really it's their loss.

My point of this poll was to see if Majestic was right in her opinion that the majority here doesn't want males on the forum, and it seems I am proving my point in proving her wrong. And I said I would leave if the majority ruled in her favor, as I would not want to be around those type of people, that's my opinion and my right. I made the wager with Majestic, which is seems she is ignoring, and that's fine, because she thinks no males should be here... so if I'm right about the majority, then she should either accept that the males are here or leave like I would if the majority did in fact agree with her. If you don't like being around certain people then why stand there and complain over and over about it?

Like others have said, it's like going into someone's house and complaining about the decor and such and telling them to change it! Or it's like an atheist going into a christian church and complaining that they are speaking from the christian bible and that there is so much religious stuff around, doesn't make much sense does it? No, an atheist just wouldn't go to church! So why is she coming to a community where the people she doesn't want to be around are a part of and telling us we should not have them here? It's pure stupidity.

Either way, I believe I've proved my point, now she can grow up and accept what this forum is, or she can go find another one, or make her own like Wahaika has.

[Andy]

Grace, One of the problems that I have with majestics comments. Is the fact that they are a personal belief not related to NBE. Further, they are beliefs that she has vented here before. http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=4020&page=1
She has a right to her belief. She has expressed once it already. Now there is a resurgancece of males in the males section, and now she has expressed it yet again. To what avail? Like most people that come here we are simply looking for information on a subject this site addresses. Many people come hear looking for information and to ask questions as guests. I try and chip in where possible and respect everyone else. I for one try not to make comments when I feel that they may be taken amiss. Much of what is discussed here I have no knowledge of and rermain quiet. I have no desire cause problems here on the site. The mens section was here on the old site and eve brought it over to the new site. Genetic male and females have always been ,and felt, free to comment on the diffrent forums. I have stated the last time majesic posted this statement, that the board should not change to satisfy the desires of one person. That is why you are seeing a poll and strong comments about this. It is as wahakia said. It is old material. Negative thoughts re-posted to cause disruption and harm. Due to her post earlier this year, she was aware of the response she would get.

[grace]

I really do agree with what you are all saying and I too feel that Majestic's words were awful. (just to clarify.) I was just sad to see all the anger and hatred in general in the "men do not belong here" thread. In the future I think that we should ignore posts like Majestic's rather than try to voice opinions, because clearly Majestic isn't going to change her mind and I don't think we should feed to the drama that she was trying to create. Basically Mira sums up how I feel:

Not only to Majestics (but brought up because of him) but a good reminder to all of us:

"Never judge the lives of others, because each person knows only their own life and renunciation. It's one thing to feel that you are on the right path, but it's another to think that yours is the only path.” - Plato

[DoubleCs]

I read what Majestic had to say & ignored it because I didn't want to feed her fire. I knew that replying would only give her satisfaction. While reading through her posts though, I honestly thought that she was someone who probably had a lot of wrong done to her & that it was also probably a personal matter. However, I also thought that she was hiding behind a keyboard & trying to raise her self-esteem by voicing her opinion in a rather rude way because she could not voice her opinions about things in real life. There are ways to get your point across without having to be aggressive. Another thing, her arguments were based solely on belief, & beliefs are extremely difficult to change. Once they are hammered into you & you keep them that way up to your 20's & 30's, it's hammered into you.

Of course, it seems that many people still do not understand that society is ever changing & that what is seen as "right or wrong" & "good or bad" is ever changing as society develops & progresses towards new possibilities. It's a proven fact that many of those in the younger generations become more tolerable to things that were once seen as "wrong" or "bad." Also, no matter how much we want those prejudiced people to just go away, it won't happen. I agree with Grace. They'll stick around & there's really nothing we can do except ignore them. If we don't feed into the drama, then they'll eventually stop.

Another thing though, I don't understand why Majestic & those who are uncomfortable with men on the forum don't leave. There are a lot of great information here, but this isn't the only NBE forum out there. Also, they could just browse here for information without registering & posting their pictures. & Majestic really does give out misleading information to the newbies on this community. I had to correct her obviously failed attempt to research thoroughly into things to a new member on her personal program page. I don't think Majestic is here to help. Majestic gave out misleading information, which, I believe, is an idiotic thing to do. Don't give out false information if fact/evidence is extremely apparent & going to prove you wrong. I don't know if Majestic had any growth, but even if she DID, she shouldn't try to lessen other people's chances of it, especially since this forum was created in order to help people as much as possible.

Also, I never had a problem with men on this forum. I never even gave it a second thought. I thought it was amazing of Eve to do something like that, & Cheryl is one of my biggest inspirations! I didn't care that she was once a man. All that I was focused on was her SUCCESSFUL GROWTH; NOT her GENDER. After all, that's what this whole community is about!

Just decided to put my two cents [actually more lol] in this :]

[kerensa]

Majestic does have a right to her opinion, however i feel some opinions are best kept to ones self if it is likely not only to cause offence to others, but going back many years ago when i was totally confused about who or what i was, reading something like her thread could of caused temporary mental damage at this point in my life. I do not see myself as a pervert or want to gain breast growth for sexual kicks, i need them i feel so i can become the person i really am and to start leading some kind of "normal life", i know this probably sounds all too strange for most people and i wish i could explain how i feel inside or how my brain works. I feel as if i am a good husband to my wife and an excellent dad to my children and most of my friends just see me as a right jack the lad kind of bloke, but hidden away somewhere is this girly person who raises her head now and then and thats when the trouble starts, but to cut a very long story short and to get back to the thread, this female thing inside me is fed up of being locked away and wants to join a coalition with the rest of me and despite years of battles with myself which has resulted in two attempts of ending my life, i want her here too and i see getting boobs as a way of achieving this. When alls said and done we are all different and yes everyone does have a right to their own opinion, however refering to males who want boobs as being perverts or getting sexual kicks i feel is way to over the top, when just saying i dont agree with this would be sufficient. Just because one person doesnt agree with what another is doing, does not make it wrong.

[Wahaika]

My points are really similar to Graces. But here it goes... (Please read with humor in pointing out lapses in logic, not with accusation.)

First I have to say, this is a stacked survey if I ever saw one. For a male to vote in this would be a conflict of interest. At least six out of the 14 who voted yes are the very males that would be kicked off. tsk tsk tsk. Bad form guys. But hey, you're in good company since there is no right and there is no wrong on this board, only feelings.

I definitely think that all of you females who voted yes have an ever so slight problem with hypocrisy. How in the world do you justify slamming someone for being negative and prejudiced with a demand for some to leave the board, and then turn around and attack the exact same way while demanding the very thing to which you object? (For hourglasswannabe, I went to great lengths to avoid ending that run on sentence with a preposition.)

And then there is the wonderful situation for Anastasia and I. We are kicked off no matter what. You see:
If Majestic wins in her survey, I have to go because I am a man.
If Anastasia wins in her survey, I have to go because I am predjudiced. (As if that was a crime.)

If Majestic wins in her survey, Anastasia by default loses her survey and has to go because she said she would.
If Anastasia wins her survey, she has to go because she has prejudice against the predjudiced, which makes her predjudiced. In fact, by voting yes, all of you have to go for that same reason.

Wahaika

[Andy]

I (and other genetic males) were invited to participate by the poll poster. The poll question was about people coming onto this forum and posting negative comments to a segment of the membership. So no. I don't consider it bad form.