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Tibetan's PM and Experimental Thread


Are you gals really serious about NBE? This is more tedious than you think.
Its more than studying biology, its learning YOUR body/herbal phytochemical compounds/ getting test panels/ understanding them/ realizing what you need/ reading everything you can until someone forces your eyelids shut to rest, and then do it all over again, lol! And finally... its trial and error in rigging your own body for nbe success! Everything is here and if not, you probably did not spend enough time finding it. If for some reason it really isn't here, request a subcategory section for it. The easiest part is actually looking for the links/categorized forums you are inquiring about. If you are having trouble doing that, than its not time for NBE.

Now, I made a pact between God and I that I would post my notes by creating another thread entirely if I found I had personal success with anything I tried for nbe. This is my way of giving back to the forum. I learned so much here and I am still learning. If it wasn't for Anastasia's personal testimony with BO, I would have never known to try it and probably would have given up. It was after all, my 4th attempt. I would not be where I am now, before trying PM as my 2nd program. I will document everything I can think of that I am doing (that is most important.) I won't tolerate non readers who ask questions that have already been answered here, I'm just too busy with far more complicated things in my life. So read everything as well as contribute to the forum, it just works better that way. More heads are better than one, that's for sure.

If you are underage (<18), just know, if you toy around with herbals, you can do detrimental harm to your endocrine system. Real hormones your body makes are actually much stronger than the herbs you are tempted to take, which is why many of you don't respond to supplements you've taken in the past (its more about how your body is working and absorbing these phyto chemicals, not how estrogenic they are.) So think sensitivity and communication between cells. So if your cells are not healthy communicating cells, you are just in for some disappointing and possibly detrimental results. What works for one person, will often times not work for another the same. So keep that in mind if attempting to do things blindly.

If you use supplementals, you will risk shutting your own hormonal output and that is like BC if done longterm. Longterm BC= STERILITY and most often times, hormonal imbalance. So get on the good foot, if you suspect you are not developing into a woman the way God intended, ask mom and dad for you to see an endo/pediatrician to find out if your hormones are balanced and take it from there. Its what I would do if I were you in the day and age, and what I wish I would had done looking back. I probably would have caught my hashimoto's in its early stages to do something about it. If Other than that, eat clean and enjoy being a damn kid! You have all your life to grow your breasts to size Q if you dare... I had my first success at 30! YepSmile

This is now the beginning of the 4th cycle of not being on BO. The flow was heavy on the 1st through the 3rd day of menses after spotting for 2 days. I was 3 days late into my cycle. This cycle happened around the full moon.

I started roughly on 250mg of SP extract(glyerine) with 40mg of liquid ainterol PM added on the 3rd day of menses. The 2nd day of menses was 250mg (glycerine) of SP only.

My menses seem to have stopped. I feel like I had minimal spotting upon wakeup and I have no flow so far up into this mid day. I will continue to do roughly 200mg of SP/w 40mg of PM. I may up the SP back to 250mg. So this is day 3 of the combo. I will think about doing 7-8 days vs. the 10 I was planning. I pumped last night as well as the day before. I may continue to do this daily. I feel like I am now the size I was before stopping BO at my fullest which is now a small D cup.

For the first ten days is PM, 5 days starting on the 3rd day of my menses.

40mg of PM (days 1-5) 80mg of PM (5-10)
500mg of SP (1-5) 1gm of SP (6-10)
PC 1 dropper (7-14) PC 2 droppers (15-24)


okay so by day 12 into the cycle, I experienced major mid cycle pains. So I think I need to adjust. I stopped PM on day 12 or 13. And I did feel intense shooting pains for those last two days on PM. So I think I will lower my SP dose.
Do the following next cycle:
500mg SP in the Am all cycle long.(maybe)
120mg PM (divided into 3 doses) for 10 days starting on day3.
PC only as needed in luteal.

The aches continue in the ovaries so Im not going to do PC this rest of the cycle. As for my breasts, they are liquid mush. I have not had follicular river flow (ovulation) into luteal and if so, it was mild. They are the same size, no new growth to report. I did pump daily for 5 days straight and do not like it. I will revert back to every other day or so like I always used to.

So I did vigorous massage n pumping. I feel it helped stick around this am. Nothing Significant of course, but good blood flow. I noticed this am, ovulation has occurred. My libido is up and I took 250mg of SP and that's it.

I'm due for a massage session! I feel like my right breast is expanding. I cant believe it! I hate how my left is slow to catch up. I give it more massage attention. I'm starting to think its just slow everytime a growth spurt happens. I don't know if its just filling out more or what. But after the vigorous massage a few days ago, I feel like they perked up a bit more and maybe have a chance at growing again!
I am in luteal and my cycle is due in about 8 days or so and they feel like water of course. Its weird, for the longest time they were nice and perked up like breast implants, but now they are more like real breasts. You can tell they are real and they don't look that fake like they used to. Im still on 250mg of SP and thats it.
From now until August of this year, I will be messing with PM and SP combo and a little PC. I see the endo later this month and planning on getting a test panel done.

So my labs are back on my thyroid, I had a feeling they may come back not so good. I am sad to say, my hashis antibodies are still there, tearing up my thyroid. They are pretty much the same, 351, maybe a lil higher ;(

I changed my diet a lot, apparently, I am still consuming something my body is reacting to. Here are a list of things I eat almost daily:

peppers, hot/mild
nuts, seeds
seeded GF bread
chicken (grainfed)
glycerine extracts (sp/pm)
collagen chicken
brown rice
canned coco water

Its one or more of these above. I have quit dairy, soy, almost eggs but eggwhites are in the bread! I have no change in skin and I believe that is why, its my hashis. So what to do? I guess Ill start basic, I need to just eat:
grassfed beef/fat, bone broth, greens, and fruit. Simple and boring, but I possibly have to do it.

As far as NBE goes, ehh, I have no idea. I like to take glycerine extracts but if its made from soy, it maybe a problem. I am seeing an endo later this month, I hope to get allergens tested and TH 1/2 tested. Good news is though, I do not have calcium deficiency, and am no longer on the low end of iron, I don't have lupus (test) and my vitamin D for once is in good normal range! So I know, a high raw is the way to go for me. I guess I just have to do it right this time. No grain at all till my gut heals anyway.

Considering eliminating my extracts and going utterly simple, SP in capsule form. PM tabs (glamour which I had left over) and topical PC.

well, now Im torn! I dont know if I should do glamour which I have six months of, or ainterol extract. It makes me mad, they don't put the ingredients in the listing (is it P Glycol, V Glycerine or something else??) and with glamour, what brightening agents are used and sugar ingredients, coloring agents? are they natural? Geez! I will be taking these supps daily, any small amount of bad can cause antibody havoc!

So I sent the 4 bottles of saw palmetto extract back to Swanson's yesterday. They are just great! I told them of my possible reaction from it and they are giving me a refund. So I have decided I will take SP caps from mountainroseherbs. I am contacting Ainterol to see what their extracted medium is derived from. I hate it when companies do this, not list the exact ingredients! I have 6 months left of Glamour so maybe Ill just used that for my program. Not sure.
As for my boobs, they look bigger! The are responding to vigorous massage and I think I am sore for a few days when I do it right and so I am thinking to pump every third or fourth day or when my boobs don't sore. I have massive top cleavage and still need filling out on the bottoms. I am feeling the luteal phase so I hope I keep it all. Its still jelly water-like, but just more. Even my areolas are puffier, eghh.

Wow, my breasts are more swollen, I am due for pumping and massaging. I am not doing any PC or have been for luteal phase, nor PM or SP eversince 4 days ago or so. I dont know if I should try PC to reduce swelling or let it ride. I am feeling very fertile this cycle. I think I am retaining water.

As for my health, I am tired today. I have good and bad. I decided to drop the nightshades from here as well. So my diet now for 6 months is very strict (unless I can confirm I have no food allergies).

Wow. Coming up when my menses start, I will be 4 months total off of BO. I have about 3 days left till then Wink But since my period is late everytime thereafter, I start my menses this month on the 17th. I'm starting to think that when getting off of herbs or glandulars, my natural hormones are more powerful when they spike. So I am glad for this break and small break from PM, SP, and PC. Though I used a tiny amount of pc yesterday.
I did my pumping of each breast and massaged all the points last night and they seem to be holding up the swelling a little longer. I see that my breasts have widened again and are fuller, bringing in more cleavage. So, I cant say I grew, not till the cycle ends and I see what's left over in about 7 days from here. Its luteal, and I was this size before my fast. So I can say, I have a little swelling, possibly new growth. It seems from losing weight by extreme measures, though it goes fast, the weight lost in the breasts come back around the 3 month mark. It has happened to my friend and now I can confirm this with myself.

I've just ordered my PM from rakuten. Since I have a possible allergy with PG, VG extracts, I've decided to go with sisters brand. I hope it works. Its very low dose of 165mg. If I have to double up, I will. But this will be a good little test. Well see how one cycle goes.

I think I'll do 80 mg of ainterol and then double it to 165mg. My SP dose will be 550mg daily since I can't half them. I'll use PC on luteal only if I must. I've just been feeling more fertile than ever before so I think my healthy eating and break is helping my glandular system produce its own. That's the real reason why my dose is so low. I know I can always titrate up. I dont know if I want to continue pumping. I will massage daily though. I think I want to grow a cup and then add pumping back, but for right now, I have a feeling I will do well with hand massaging.

So today, I woke up with cramps. She's coming any day now. Boobs are still sore. I can't believe how full they got within a two week period. It feels nothing like the rock hard swelling I used to get. Hopefully its my real size.

Wow, I had steak, guac, flax seed crackers with apple throughout the day and some grassfed beef for dinner yesterday and last night, sometime after midnight, I had the worst night sweats, I mean drenched! I felt so gross, I had to get a towel and sop up my bed and pillow. Its been a really long time since I had had that, that bad! I thought about how awful I felt yesterday afternoon sometime after those crackers. I had pricking sensations fingers knees and face. I think I ate too many flax seeds and I may be allergic?? I had heart pain and just felt my thyroid aching. I have felt these before. Honestly, I have no Idea if I had been glutened somehow or what at the restaurant, but I felt like it was a flare up and somehow affected my thyroid. Maybe my thyroid had an excessive attack from these antibodies?? I was dumping excess thyroid hormone? Maybe it was too much estrogen from the the flax crackers? I have no idea. I just felt awful. Maybe its my LDL cholesterol. I have it on the high end. Maybe I cannot handle fatty soup stews?
As for the boobs, I have them nice and full still. I hope to get my cycle tomorrow.

I had the sweat pool again last night but not as bad. I should be getting period tonight. I woke up with a little more swelling this am and am having some cramps.

Its been 12 days since I have not been on SP and PM. As for PC, I just put a few drops not the full dose on, two days ago and then again last night so I can sleep. I also put a few drops on my thyroid and the rib cage, underneath the breasts. I haven't pumped since I last noted. I feel they are so sensitive from massaging, that I don't feel the need to pump. It hurts too much.

Yay! I received my order from mountainroseherbs for SP. Now I'm waiting for my PM from Japan! After having so much trouble with the merchant to take payment (mind you, the translation in eng to jap /jap to eng), I was finally able to get it accepted and actually go through. Boy, is it expensive!
So, I do feel the flow slowly traveling down the tubes! I am cramping on and off. I love how last cycle around the full moon, I started. I hope this month is the same! I need that extra moon power, lol. I'm always freakin' late!
As for the girls, nice and full. They are still a D cup. Lots of veinage and top tissue. I would love to get some under boobage! I am wondering if its scoliosis that's producing this effect or if its underdeveloped glands?
I look at Cheryl's and see her top boobage is crazy more than her under. She has narrow roots. I have wide roots, so the only thing I've figured out here, is that narrow roots project further out, away from the chest wall, while wide roots stick to the chest wall more, with less projection. But I have not figured out this top heavy/bottom heavy situation. Completely dumbfounded! I still have not pumped in fear to areola stretching. I am doing hand massages. I figured out that Emu oil is bad for me! I feel like its very androgenic. Every time I used it for topical massage, I got hairs around the nipple, just a couple! Everytime I stopped, they went away! What the heck! I figured it makes hair grow nicely or is somewhat androgenic. My breasts would feel so limp like. So I stay away from it and just use cheap vit e oil made from soy I'm sure. I use seabuckthorn still. Just love that funky smell...

Loads of cramps, they are now traveling down more. Tonight, Im expecting my menses. The breasts are fabulous and full. I just got my PM shipped out today. I should get it later this week. If so, it will be just in time for my last week's follicular dose.

The next thing I'd like to get would be, fish omega oil and or fish collagen, I'm afraid I may be allergic to the grain fed chicken sources. I just want to be careful with these antibodies!

Guess what? No Period! jEESsh! I am so pissed.I'm actually spotting into my menses like last month. Maybe I need BO. I don't want to go back to it right now. I was pretty regulated on it. I just think I need more progesterone. Maybe I have estrogen dominance. So I saw my endo, it looks like I will have to wait 3 weeks from now to test my hormones. Ill def find out soon! I need to be patient. As for the girls, nice and full, same. No changes to report,, just waiting on menses.

Finally! 3 days late into my next cycle. I am going to start my sp sometime today if the flow is good. My breasts are a little more squishy but they are holding up and a bit tender from massage.
I may do 40mg of pm before bed tonight.

Second day of my menses, and I am happy I am having a full on period. They used to be so light in flow on bo and done with in 3days. But, they were a little more on time. So now I'm having the opposite, I am having a heavier flow and its done on day five and they come later. Not that good, but much better than before I started over a year ago when I wasn't having a period at all. I just did 550mg of SP in the am with a couple tabs of alfalfa for my thyroid pituitary function. I did my PM dose of 40mg mid day and I am noticing no effects on my period flow which is good. Maybe Ill do 80 mg tomorrow. I'm still waiting on my PM tabs to arrive, any day now. Boobs have already deflated just a tad the yesterday but they are still there, nice and full. I will do 40mg at night with my pro biotic drink.
I will prob continue 80mg dose till day 6.

Yay! The goods came in! I got 6 mo.worth pm to experiment with. Can't wait for day 6! I think I'll crush it and swallow. I'm just not sure of how my liver is functioning.


I have taken 2 sp pills today instead of one.

I have following measurements:
Bust: 35.5"
Underbust: 25.5"
waist: 24.5"
hips: 35.5"
weight: 99lbs! The lowest I've been with this size of a chest! That is actually good news. I was fluxing between 35.5-35.75" when I was 103-105lbs!

I am even now. Id like to shrink to my natural waist 22.5" I don't think that's gonna happen anytime soon with hashis and these cortisol issues I have, but I'll try.

I am almost done spotting from my period. Its day 6, I have taken my first PM pill. I just crushed it. I also took 1 40mg drop for my AM dose and tonight will be another 40mg. So that's 245mg of PM per day and 1,100mg SP.

What my typical meal plan is (still tweaking):

- 1/3 pineapple/2 bananas/some cocomeat/half can of cocowater ( 1 QT size mason 4 breakfast)
- A few dates (snack)
- 2 green corgettes (noodles)/ delicata slices/grass fed meat portion w/ herbal broth (lunch)
- greens (spinach/herbs/fruit smoothie Dinner )

I had my first 10drops of desicated thyroid ( I brewed months back). I bought Dr.Ron's brand. I really hope it works for me.

My breasts are ultra mushy since yesterday! I feel like I am a full C again! I keep fluxing between C&D! I know its my diet. Im not getting enough protein or calories. I am getting loose in the under bust! I swear, my breasts seem smaller but they still measure 35.5" I have no idea if this is going to affect how PM works. Maybe I need to just focus on my hashis for now.

I have been noticing the past couple of days, wetness! I have never had this before, not this early. I know its the PM. I am on day 5 with the next 2 to go and I am done for this first cycle. No tingles or anything to measure. I am thinner now and my breasts seem to flux with that so I am not expecting anything soon.

Last day of PM.

I am going to do my PC tonight before bed. I am low in P and it should help me sleep. I still have the wetness. Its not massive but its there. Today I will do my first 2nd dose of SP 550mg before bed. I will see if this is good for the last half of my cycle. I will do 3/4 dropper of PC and a bout a pump of what I had left over from months ago from some PC mom gave me.

I did a pump of PC this am and fish oil with PM. I've been doing Dr. Rons formula for thyroid glandular and take the brew I made , half a dropper 2x daily with my probiotic. I have not pumped since a while! I have no guessing when knowing my actual size. I am only doing this to see if they grow and not to affect areola stretching.
So I do hand massage every night for like five minutes.

5th day of pc regi with 2 caps of SP daily. I took fish oil for these past five days. Still doing 2 pumps daily. I feel my volume is a bit more. I have more meatier feeling and I feel like Im widening again. I hope this means I am filling out. I have been having some itching around the areola lately. So that's good sign wise. My nails are stronger these days, I have noticedWink My band is looser on all my bras now and I can see a more chiseled ribcage, thanks the heavens!

8th day of PC. I feel a little plumper. I feel like im still not growing on my bottoms. Just slowly filling. Itching areolas daily. I dont know if I have yeast/fungus coming out (Im on a probiotic) or if its weather related or if its the regi. I am going to do PC nightly for tonight. I am still seeing development only on tops and sides and not on the bottoms. I feel like if it keeps going this way, shit's gonna look weird!

I'm not pumping on purpose. I ordered raw mammary to see if it gets corrected. Maybe I have a constricted band issue? I have tiny nipples with a larger areola, not balanced. Im hoping the glandular will strengthen and further develop the actual nipple and ducts. It just looks like low poles, not quite tuberous nor normal because they are much fuller and rounder than tuberous. Weird...

Day 9. I did a half dose of PC this morning along with my usual took 40mg of pm for the heck of it and 550mg of SP and Fish oil. I can feel my breasts bloating, prob from the E surges this cycle. I guess its balancing out.I like how I dont have ovarian aches like when I took BO.

I think I will try this coming cycle:
days 1-3 40mg PM
4-6 80mg PM
7-13 240mg Pm

Day 10 of lut, breasts are swollen. I know its luteal swelling. It feels like it. Sore and bloated a bit. I have no Idea if this is growth.
Okay so its day 21 of my cycle. I did my hormone panel this am! I'm so happy! I'll get results on the 19th! I also did my ultrasound on my thyroid! I can't wait for those results. I've been itching with eating finger bananas and apples??

Wowzers, I seem to be plumping up from Luteal. They are nice and rounder! I wish this can stay till next cycle. I am hopeful they will keep some. My mom commented yesterday on how big they are. I guess losing abit in the underbust makes them stand out more. I am filling the D bra to the fullest at this moment. I would love to be an E cup! I am so wideset, they'd never look atrocious on me. I had a little itchiness yesterday around the areolas again, wish I knew what that was.

Day 23 (12 Luteal), I have looked in the mirror and noticed the breasts toppling (tops sig bigger than the bottoms) Its weird! I truly think I either have a ligament problem or IGT! I have no development on the bottoms of the breasts. So weird and my breasts continue to fill out radially and not project forward in increases. Its so funny, I actually have more attractive breasts at a size small C. I thought the bigger they got, the more they would fill out evenly!

I must research to find out how I can develop that under portion. Dormant mammary glands? Anyway, I pumped today for the first time since last I noted on here. I figured I could use some circulation 7 days prior to starting cycle #3 on PM (though its my first month with sisters brand) and 5 cycles off of BO (I think). I'm getting a great itching sensation from pumping, I think this is what I need every time. So maybe for me, pumping less often is best? Just in case I failed to mention, I started taking deer antler velvet for IGF-1. It was another tincture I made months ago. I just take in the mornings daily.

An hour n a half later and my swelling is still there! I normally deflate by now. Its gotta be hormones/water retention. Though I have pumped many a day and luteal and no swelling retained. Strangely it only measured at 36".

five days till my menses start. Great swelling happening! I had some left over this am and this is what I wished my breasts look like, perfect size and shape is better. Damn, too bad its swelling, but I did feel some itching again.

4 days till menses. I am feeling some slight cramps. I might be a day or two late. I pumped again last night and today. I am still swollen. I know its luteal swelling. I am hard to the touch. I am 97lbs! I weighed this am upon wake up and had a small banana! I was not expecting that!! I am so happy, this makes so much sense now as to why my bust measurement is not pushing past 35.5" and my ass is also 35.5" I'm even, but under my BMI??? I like being no more than 103 and well, I am skinny curvy at this weight, if that makes any sense. I have NEVER been this big in the chest at this weight! I know for a fact if I gained 8 lbs, my breasts would be a whole cup to cup and a half larger. I feel a little better on this thyroid tincture. I had two sweaty nights the day before yesterday and before that. I don't know if I'm adjusting or what, but its nothing like the month before.

I had an appt today and I had my temp taken via ear and I am happy to report my lut temp is good at 98.7. I a m also having more cramps and I am hoping its going to be on time.

All my swelling went down. I really think it is the drop in hormones, I stopped the PC 5 days before my menses so thats prob what it was. Its two days before my scheduled menses, so I am thinking THIS IS WHY SOME GALS GET GREAT SWELLING, and in my case, my hormones where finally high enough to keep that great swelling while I pumped. So all those months, I had no response to my hormone flux must be why I was with mallowy breasts.
Pros to mushy: its your real size at least
Cons to mushy: it means not enough hormone flux to get the girls to respond/growing (my guess anyway). So my conclusion is that I had not enough progesterone all these months. I will confirm it when I get my labs back, sometime today.

Wow! My menses came today, though I had spotting yesterday. Five days late! WTH??Flow is normal at least. I either have bad circulation or had done something wrong here with my PM/PC Schedule. I was due on the 22nd. My docs office sux! I never got my results. So I dont know what I am lacking or dominant in. I dont know what to do at this point. I stopped PM on day 12/13. Today I took my first armour (crushed) tab. I am noted to start on 90mg from my ultrasound lab results. I did 60mg this am around 9 am. I wonder how this will effect my NBE program. I am still taking dr rons glandular, about less than half a dropper at night.

Took a 40mg PM dose am.
I also took a crushed mammary glandular tab from standard process
2 sp caps @ 550mg

2nd day of my cycle. I am entering the 3rd cycle for PM. I did get a couple of cramps but I am okay.
I think Ill just do ten days of PM, period and see if my menses start on time.
I took 90mg of armour around 9 am.
total PM 80mg
2 SP caps
(1) 185mg mammary pmg

I am light today. Maybe the 80mg of PM is stopping it. I measured last night:
bust: 35.75"
underbust: 26" even
weight: 98lbs

Today is day 4, I have taken my sisters brand PM (165) + 40mg= 205mg
Ill take another 40mg tonight. I am practically done with my period. Breasts are nice and not super mushy.

Wow, I realized I have been losing some cellulite and with that, I have lost a cup on my chest. I am just a C cup. I guess this raw vegan diet is no good for nbe. But this is okay. I can see my ribs definition now and I hope to reach my tiny waist goal back. Yes, my breast shape is not as nice and full like it was. I am tech below my BMI, but I really need to lose this cellulite at all costs. I have fat under my chin I NEED to lose and my stomach that NEEDS to go fully, I am not going to get scared of my losses. I know I need protein and fats for growth. But for now, I am sticking with it. My ass is smaller too. I really want my hour glass but the right way, not with cellulite on my belly or chin. My weight is 96lbs!

hormone Blood Tests ***UPDATE***
I had lower estrogen than progesterone (luteal) but I am on the lower end for both in luteal.
112 for Estroidal / 111 is the last of the high range for luteal
11.7 for progesterone (21 day of the cycle)
So its been 3 weeks or so since my last update. I have yo-yo boobs, one day theyre bigger, next day their smaller. Okay, so I ordered mammary tabs from ebay this time its the triple strength formula. Its been harder and harder to get a hold of standard process,let alone the glands, period!

I talked to a man who sold nothing but glands and could not assure the effects of taking mammary, but that he was always sold out from the TG's buying it. I am trying it because BO is no longer for me. I feel it has done its course and I need strengthening in the actual breast tissue and nipple department. I was looking at the oddities (how my left has still not caught up and developed more rounded like my right. Its smaller and the areola is bigger (common with snoopy boobs) and not only that, poor nipple development, its smaller and more flaccid.

This led me to believe, I need to strengthen the glands itself and hopefully, my nipple and shape will catch up. Im looking to experimenting with higher doses of this mammary formula. I have been taking 180-360mg ( sorry if I may not have mentioned the dose fluxing) for the past month. Its too soon to tell if it has any effect at all. I am in luteal so I am a little fuller. I will up the dose to 900mg and see how that goes daily for 2 cycles. I am still doing this high raw/fasting/vegan diet, but lately this week, I've been eating meat, eggs, gf bread and rice. I'm still under my bmi as my portions are small.

I've decided to cool it on the PM/PC/SP regi for the rest of this cycle. I think I am going to experiment with trying to raise my natural P levels rather than supplementing it with otc PC. I may use PM in the last half of the cycle (10-14 days, which I have yet to decide). I just think its best to get my own surges of P. I learned about this method by a woman, a.k.a. She-rah (read all about her here):


I think I will start this next cycle. Other than that, I have not pumped since I last noted. I just think I need a break.

I took my first ramped dose of mammary glandulars.
I did around 900mg, 3 divided daily dose. Brother's brand with black cohosh and milk thistle.

I have started my menses. I took my first pm dose for this cycle. I will finish my sisters brand every cycle for the next 5 months . First half of the cycle. I took the usual 165+80mg drops. I did my 900mg of mammary today.

I did nearly 1200mg of mammary today. I did my normal dose have the best swelling today! I am end of day 3 of my cycle. I had a couple raw organic eggs this am for breakfast. Why not?
I did my normal dose of pm and its the third day of pumping and I'm wondering if I will end up lactating. Hopefully not. But that is what mammary is usually taken for.

I ate 2 raw eggs for breakfast as part of my raw diet for aminos. This is the 2nd day. I am wondering if this will help me with cleansing. Noticing the short term pumping is really sticking around! I have no luck in foll. for this! This is unusual for me. Something is def going on. The only major diff is I dropped SP and no collagen tabs or any PC this last cycle.
Its pretty simple what I am doing. Its just low dose of PM and Mammary upped to 900mg (1200mg here and there).
I could be collecting milk or strengthening my glands, which is what I am hoping for.

Also, I am a few months into my thyroid meds. So maybe this IS IT? It is known for fat distribution to be corrected with thryoid hormones months in. Maybe that's what I needed all these years. I just started taking a bit of Deer antler again,( I failed to mention I was off of it for a little while) since I had some left over. Just the usual morning dose. My menses are almost over. I really hope I can keep this up. Ill continue to pump daily or skip one here and there to see if I lactate or grow. Its sticking for some reason and also, I am seeing more of this weird shaping of the breast. I might have constricting bands or some kind of underdeveloped glands that sit under neath each breast. Left is worse of course (its always been the worse shaped of the two as I have mentioned). This is my main reason for experimenting with mammary glandulars. I need to know if this can further develop my glands (underboob). Still, nothing has changed, it's like the bigger they get, the more the top and inners fill, but the bottoms, forget it!

I hate this so much. Something is wrong here. Again, it could be the scoliosis I have, making them appear this way. But at least, the breast veins are alive and the widening keeps happening. As I have mentioned, they like to spread out and grow rather than protrude. I have wide roots. I don't think I have "shallow breasts" though.

This is my last day for PM. Feeling a little tingle in the ovary and right breast (outer). Its gone now. I am at my lowest in weight and measurements:

34.5" bust!
25.25" underbust
23" waist
34.75" butt!
95lbs in weight

6 days before my menses are due!
I have been taking 900mg of mammary which has 450mg of black cohosh. I have noticed super mallowy breasts. This is the 2nd cycle of doing mammary (almost 2 months), but the first cycle of having a high dose between 900-1200mg of it. No change in size, but I am wondering as I get into the 3rd or 4th cycle of the high dose, if it will begin to show. Nothing new to report. I am taking damiana tea starting today to see if I will have a rise in progesterone. I suspect I am still lower in P than E. Thinking of introducing pregnelonone for luteal, starting at 50mg. But I wanted to see how damiana tea does, though I feel I am late in starting it this cycle being menses is due in 6 days. So no luteal swelling, even with pumping. I did not pump for 5 days on the last day of taking PM for follicular. I am a believer pumping works and I want to be more consistent. I am wondering if mammary supps increase prolactin, so in turn, this may be more dominant and competing with my already low progesterone. I learned it suppresses both ovulation and menstruation. So that says, if high enough amounts are taken, it will do this eventually. I read it takes 3 to 4 months of for lactating glandular function(milk) to replace fatty stores in the breasts (first trimester) I will try pregnelonone for sure next cycle if possible to create synergistic effect.
As for PM, I believe I have even stronger nails now, noticed this last week or two. Also considering whey supps or goats milk (fermented) for utilizing the benefits PM.


I have no luteal swelling and mush boobs still. I believe its a prolactin spike. My shape is less round. So I am going to lower my mammary supp and hike up my e and p. My prolactin last tested a couple cycles ago,( before mammary supps) right in the middle. I wonder what they are now.
Strange thing! I had an out of body and for those are familiar with my " A very strange but true thing you ought to know..."' thread, I attacked a young Hispanic woman whom I suspected was combining with my soul body for possession to do breast therapy. I just remember clearly pulling her hair and screaming at her that, "jumping bodies is wrong and that she has her own damn body, leave mine alone!" She fearfully said that she wasn't going to do it as the interior of my breasts were not what she wanted! I over heard her tell another girl that I attacked her and was livid pissed. She said she had a pediatrist (if that is what I heard correctly) examined my breasts to find out they were filling with milk!They know that when milk is being made, its also taking the place of the fatty tissue that would normally be there. I notice my shape is not as firm and breast volume is not nearly as much as it was when I just got off my BO program and fasting protocol happened.
So I guess this mammary supp does work to develop milk and the part of the glands that contain it. I am realizing the mushiness is the milk replacing the firm fatty tissue! This is a gut feeling. And experimenting with going on two full cycles with mammary is confirming the volume loss as well as the mushiness through out this cycle, esp. during luteal phase. Not to mention, I have seen little dried up milk in the holes of the nipples! I had noticed this last cycle as well, possibly before starting Mammary supps. Moreso on my right breast than my left, and apparently, my right is far more efficient at making milk and storing fat than my left. I was really hoping to develop the nipple to be stronger like the right one, but it has not happened yet.

still have been drinking damiana tea, expresso sizes, 3x daily since last noted (5/21 I believe). I have been downing the mammary dose to 600mg these last few days. I noticed yesterday after pumping, my breasts went up nearly a cup size and feel full and look like they used too at their fullest. I have also added a few drops of progesterone oil for massage these last few days. I have been eating more normal now and no longer calorie restricting. Two weeks, I have added back eggs into my diet, along with a slice of gf bread. I am due for my menses, so maybe all of this is the cause for the sudden increase of breast mass, though they still feel mallowy. I weighed 95lbs this morning on an empty stomach, wearing only my underwear!
current measurements:
34.5" Bust
26" under bust
23.5" waist
35" butt
I noticed my under belly is smaller!
I really want to press ahead with doing the 900mg of mammary, but now I think I do not need to. Since my goal with this initially was to develop the bottom of the breasts as well as the whole, It may not be necessary after all. I have been researching to find all of the following, indeed are just as important as the others:
Prolactin, progesterone, estrogen and some form of growth hormone. I will be doing the following in my next cycle:
skipping mammary supps for follicular.
Adding 300mg mammay for luteal (maybe)
doing double the dose of sister's pueraria which is 330mg
doing damian tea 3 micro cups daily in luteal/pc/ pregnelonone
contuing with Deer Antler velvet

I have learned its all synergy with these hormones for full development. They all promote eachothers functions to the fullest when balanced as well as compete with eachother when imbalanced so, the idea is cyclically getting in what you need when you need it. Being 6-9lbs from where I was my biggest, leads me to believe with this weightloss and hormones shifting, I had lost my fatty tissue and my prolactin was dominating the receptors. It looks that way. I was then taking prolactin facilitating supps (mammary and possibly the pm) and mamm at a higher dose, it was no wonder I could not get my shape nor size back, and I don't think it was my low BMI as I have fat around my abdomen/stomach still. Although, I do think nutrient restriction from low cal dieting had something to do with my fullness not restoring as well. They are often hot to the touch again like before I went off bo/ did the fasting. I have dropped the SP a couple cycles ago, I do not think this contributed to any volume loss or volume prevention as SP never gave me any gains in the breasts, if anything, the bottom half got cellulite and more volume.

Another great link about IGT:

Just as I suspected! Breast deformities can occur before birth! In the womb during fetal development. I truly believe my deformity is congenital.
I will totally consider this procedure (last on my current list) if all else fails!


Today I am barely starting my menses. Talk about late! I am a week late! I am not surprised as mammary glandulars probably delayed my ovulation. I am now starting since yesterday, pregnenolone 5omg sublingals. Now since I have been starting my period, I will resume on day 13 of my cycle for luteal phase only from here on out.

I plan on getting placenta soon. My breasts seem to perk back up since stopping the mammary supps. I dont know if I will continue or not. I think it may be competing with PM. But I think a small dose may be okay. If it takes 3 months for prolactin to make breasts fill with milk to replace fat, then I think my 2 months may have been enough. I did not want to induce lactation, but just further develop branching and the ducts. I did use a little topical progesterone to get my period to come on. About five days.

Now yesterday was spotting. Today, I think is my actual mense start date. I have stopped preg sublinguals till luteal. I will do my last of the PM and see how it goes this time around with normal eating and a little extra protien! I have weighed myself this morning on empty and found I am now 100lbs! I am happy and yes, this must have made my breasts fill out again and with stopping the mamm supps, they are now more round and full. I dont know what size I am but I want to say a full C small D as it stands now. Ill have to wait and see around day 8 in follicular. I may be bloated abit.
My schedule for now is:

Follicular (day 2-12)
Vit B 2,000mcg
PM upped dose to 330mg PM (sisters)
armour thyroid 45mg
DAV tincture

Luteal: (14-25+)
Daily Vit B 2,000mcg
Preg 50mg tab daily
DAV tincture
Hopefully some form of placenta

Very simplified for now.

I did 5 drops of ainterol PM. So far, I have not gone back to sisters PM. Its so expensive, ill run out of it in 2 months. I have plenty of ainterol, so Ill use that for now. Today is day 4 of my cycle. Not much blood at all!

Today, was hardly any flow. I guess just a faint few spots. I did another 5drops total today, 3 in the am and 2 in the evening. 120mg, then 80mg, so 200mg total. Girls deflated abit, but still nice and fuller with good warm temp Wink
I guess you can say, we are officially in growing season! Spring/Summer!

Today (Day 11), is the second day of taking pregnenolone at 50 mg. Yesterday was my last PM day of doing 200mg. Still pumping every other day and weigh 98lbs. I feel like a full C in follicular and a small D in luteal at this weight. Still quite mushy breasts. So no change! in actual breast growth from PM so far, but totally not a fair evaluation as I have been low cal.
now I am 99.5lbs! Eating normal again has helped in the breast dept. My shape is coming back. It was my right breast that was lagging. It was lopsided compared to my left! Now they are both perked. I know for a fact, the milk was coming in on those glandulars. My plan now is to stay off of mammary and see if this new cycle coming up, I can get back to widening like I was on PM, before the glandulars were added in. I suspect the second cycle from here will do it as it will be 3 cycles off of the glandulars. I just wanted to further ductal growth along with the milk glands. Breasts are rounder, larger and lifted as well as the cleavage coming back to normal. My areolas are lighter and they are still mushy but maybe not as mushy. I am taking SP glycerin extract, about 10 drops sublingual 2-3x daily.

Pumping every other day instead of daily.

Tomorrow will be 12 days of preg 50mg. My breasts after pumping last night were very swollen. My nipples and areolas are sore! This has not happened in so long! I don't know if its sp or preg or a combo of both. This am, I was having shooting pains in my left breast! I pumped and the shooting pains came back in the same exact area! It was painful. I imagine I'm either very sensitive to estrogen or it like letdown of milk coming in. I hope its not going to turn into some painful lactation. They are hot and heavy! They look more their size.

Today is the 14th day of preg! I still have tenderness and shooting pains! I can't even pump, they are so sore and sensitive. I just pray I am not going to full on lactate! Its not the whole of the breasts, but on my right, its behind the areola, and left, its the outer side of it.I noticed my areolas have darkened abit! They have been so light with PM. I guess preg is working for progesterone. I know I need to be careful because not all the time, will it make progesterone, I could be making androgens for all I know. But, I believe, I am getting what I need for this cycle. they are rounder like before.

Strange, I have not been so sensitive to hormone flux's in so long. Its like when I first started BO and took all that whey protien. It kinda feels like that. I am nice and full, prob a D cup! We'll see, I have to get my menses coming and going. Maybe I'll be quite sensitive to PM this coming cycle!

I can't wait!


4 more days til my menses are due! I am feeling more hormones in my body! I think maybe the glandulars had increased my sensitivity to estrogen and progesterone. the areolas are still darkened and they feel very liquid. I did pump every other day. I Hopefully she'll be on time!

Wow, I am on time for my menses! I cant believe it! I think my combo is working. I am not spotting, but having a real period! As far as the boobs go, I feel like they are back at their small D size! I am elated, they can come back at the right weight. Areolas are still dark and I am experiencing some needling behind my areola, yesterday and today.

I may revise slightly here:

Day 1
ainterol drops 80mg am dose/ 40 pm dose
SP daily 20 drops daily
DAV quarter dropper dose daily

Days 2-12
PM either 5 drops of ainterol/ 2 sisters PM pills daily
SP drops 20 daily
DAV quarter of a dropper daily

Days 12-28
Preg 50mg
SP drops 20 daily
DAV Daily same amount
Ovine Placenta 400mg am dose

I just ordered the placenta and hopefully, it should come in a couple weeks in time for luteal! next is some kind of amino or protien collagen.

Simple program! I may add extra protein, though I don't care to gain any weight. So we'll see!

Today, my menses are ceasing. Its the 3rd day of PM and 2 days of sisters dose. I have been reading placenta can restore hormone levels and also boost milk production in nursing mothers. I am starting to think this is an adaptogenic effect. I am not sure if I should cycle it or do it monthly. Breasts were achy yesterday and today, they are better. I feel like the D I am supposed to be. Very happy. I weigh 100/101lbs.
I purchased 400mg.

Day 6 of this cycle. My breasts are a bit sore from noogling. My areolas are still dark. I feel them very soft. No new growth to report. But, again, noticing the tops filling out more than the bottoms! I can't wait to do the fat transfer surgery. I saw an MD say for tiny people like me, we need 200CC each breast to go up a cup. I believe I have at least 600-800cc of fat on my stomach! However, I wouldn't want to go up no more than 2 cups with this procedure.
The great news is, I have the wetness back. I think 165 mg twice a day is my right dose! I feel like I am on schedule!

Day 9, I am pleased to see the wetness still happening. I have so much to look forward to on this PM experiment. Tomorrow will be my last day on it. Still waiting on placenta to arrive.

My 2nd day on Preg 50 mg and I would say I am the same size from day 1 to now or luteal of last cycle. I wouldn't call it growth but just weight gain or gaining back what was there from before my tastings. I have been doing my coconut massages with my pumping all of this time.

I can say this 4th day on preg is day 1 in luteal. I am beginning to think I have slightly darkened again in the areolas. They seem a little puffier. I feel a little fuller. I am wondering if this cycle is the cycle I begin new growth from PM? Or is it being the third cycle from my milk being replaced by the fat from PM, thus furthering development such as branching alveolar/ducts?

I feel like you can't be with out all these hormones. I hope the preg is at the right dose for it to work. I don't want to risk conversion to estrogen or testosterone androgen if I take too much. I am still testing this dose out.
I got my fish oil in. I think Ill take two in the am and 1 at night (1gm).

6 days into luteal.I ordered PM cream. I want to experiment with using it topically every other day or maybe the last half of the cycle. I still pump every other day only. I feel it works best for me. I only do about an hour (both breasts, but not together).
My breasts are slightly fuller, squishy but not as water like as before 2 cycles ago.
I only measure 35-5 to 35.75" at most.

These past few days I have been feeling a little bigger. I think I am growing lil by lil. I look fuller. I am not sure if I am passing my original size from here. I seem to have bounced back to my BO ending size last cycle (hence a few pounds less all around). We'll see in the next couple cycles.

I stared my cycle. Painful cramps. Nothing to note.

What have I learned about nbe this year? Do not fast during, ever!!!
(for hormone panel)

Sept. 10/14
From follicular phase day1-14 was 25mg am dose (preg)
From luteal phase day15-28 was 25 mg am dose/25mg dose (preg)
Armour 45-90mg every other day, alternating. SP drops 10 in the am

Light period
End of period

Time to increase protein by 20-30 GMs daily. Supplement with fish oil and pm.

Nov.13/ 2014 Finally Started protein 2x daily.

Oct 28/14.
32" overbust
35.75". Bust
26". 24"w
36.5" bum.

32.5" overbust
36.25" Bust
26.5" Underbust
25 (after eating)
36.5" bum

Nov. 19/14
New cycle started.

Nov. 20/14
40mg of ainterol pm liquid.

Nov. 22/14 AM
1st dose of 500mg ainterol pure-d

Dec. 3-4
I did 700mgPM ( 500 am dose /200mg pm dose)

Wetness more significant. Did not take pm.

Dec. 9
Breakthrough bleeding ( bright) mid cycle occurred this afternoon while shoving a raw vegan squash soup down my throat. It just randomly gushed :/ so dramatic and funny. I had been doing bio identical topical pc in wrists and chest for the past 4 days. I think I might have popped a cyst or brought on a period. I had a Sig drop of E from 700mg to O. I started 100mg this morning. My plan is to stop PC and up pm as soon as the red river flows much less. I had a queasy stomach 2 nights before. I think both E n P rising are responsible.

I guess I'll act like its an official cycle since I don't know what else to do. My areolas darkened with this time as well. Some needling. Somethinghas happened. I'll do 500mg at most once this period ends.

Attached Files

Wow your boobs look really good! I btw am deff into NBE only having some health diffuculties atm which makes pumping and maybe harmfull pills a bad idea. But PM seems to work good on everybody..Rolleyes Do you think from pills you got most benefit off PM?
Perhaps dangerous if you are before age 20. Be very cautious when you have health issues and doing nbe, but don't ever let that prevent you from doing it. It just takes more of an effort to not give up and research as much as you can.

Thank youSmile Most of my growth is from BO(as most vets here know). This thread is experimental and for the first time, I'm giving PM a real trial.

I'm looking for more eveness and filling out on my bottoms and inner as I have a mild deformity. Nothing has fully rid it and I have a feeling they'll just get bigger and rounder, which will be better than what it is now. But as for my polar placement/sloping, it will always be thereSad I also think my mild scoliosis is partly the cause.

I'm above that age further things are deff more complicated with health issues. But as soon as i have my new job with less hours i have more energy and time to enter a patient whole new journey I am going too design for myself. Its like sculpturing. A bit here and a bit there. But nooo BO for me this sounds so freaky imo with all the cow diseases and stuff, stuff from animals is ofcourse way more powerfull on our body's then something herbal. But did you felt good on it? Good results at least. Maybe a ''food support shoe sole'' can help your scolios? When it come from different lenghts in legs it can help.
Tibetan your boobs are outstanding! well done Smile
Thanks @Ella.
I see your progress is fantastic! Good to see how much you have been growing B-)
Hey, I haven't heard of pregenalone before - do you think it would be worth taking with bcp? how exactly does it work?
(18-12-2014, 08:33 PM)wizzness Wrote: Hey, I haven't heard of pregenalone before - do you think it would be worth taking with bcp? how exactly does it work?

Well. That I'm not so sure. Perhaps Lotus can help answer that questionsI know preg can be converted into testosterone and possibly estrogen. So I guess it depends on what type of BC you are on. I read about a woman who took preg 50 mg daily and she had high testosterone levels because of It. She said it was too high of a dose and that she became testosterone/ estrogen dominant.

I take it because I am not making enough p, I'm not on BC. It helped me become more regular after BO. BO helped me get my period to just come back since I was not having it at the time. But I'm often late now that im off bo. So I'm not sure if it affects all of or one of :ovarian function/ adrenal-pituitary or blood serum hormone levels (supplemental).
Took 5 drops of my sp tincture. I did an aloe arginine massage with pumping. Breasts are nice n soft.

Today is day 3 of this new unexpected cycle. I have decided to do 350mg of PM. Im trying to stop the flow. My breasts are like jelly to the touch rather than waterlike or bloated feeling.

My new dosing schedule:
1-2 no Pm
3-7 300mg PM ( 2-3 divided doses)
8-12 400-500 mg
13-14 preg 25 mg
15-23 200 mg PM/ 25mg preg/ PC/raspberry tea leaf?
24- 25 pc/25mg preg

Pump eod w/ aloe n l-arg/ take up to 10gms with l-arg/protein/2gms fo/SP or mushroom extract.

12-12-2014 (D4)
I have pumped yesterday and did the aloe/ arg massage. I hate how sticky it is. I've got a recent scar on my left breast and I am hoping this helps heal and lighten it as well.
My period is practically non existent.Smile I will be upping my dose slightly to 350 mg today. 250 mg am a 100mg pm. Have yet to try l-arg for nightly HGH release. Stuff is nasty!

12-13-2014 (D5)
I am feeling mild bloating this am. I took nearly 5gms of l arg last night. I felt almost nauseous. Plus its so nasty. I cannot do 10 GMs. And most likely won't ever.

My period is done Wink I'm happy to say PM has stopped it just like I suspected. It must have been the E drop and possibly the introduction to P topical over those next 4days. Breasts are jelly like. I took my 250mg this am and will take another 100-200mg later today. Maybe a pump session.
I am debating whether or not I should do B up drop in addition for lut only or just do what I set out to do, which is just lower my pm dose and do preg with PC . skipped arginine dose. Massaged with it and aloe /coconut though

11/14/2014 (D6)
I'm still having some bloating but it maybe due to detox or fruit juices. I think I'll stick with 350mg for today. Major wetness this morning.
New measurements:
32-7/8" overbust
36 5/8" bust
26.1/8" underbust
24" waist
36.5" hip

12/15/2014 (D7)
Some ovarian aches. I did around 450mg. I have decided to plan on introducing progestomend by Douglas labs in lut( next cycle) to see how it goes.

12/18/2014 (D10)
I felt some breast needling. I did not pump for 3 days or massaged. I have taken my half dose of 250mg (500 total)
For the first time this cycle. I will continue till the last day of foll. the same dose . have not taken the l arg since last noted.
I got sized yesterday at VS again. She said 32D but I tried one and it was too small. I tried 32dd it fit perfect. This was my size in the summertime shortly after fast. I guess I'm not yet growing out of it.
I wear a 34C (band a Little loose) at H&M.

12/19/14 (C1-D11)
I did 500mg again for the day. No needling this time. I wonder what causes it. Trying to think what was different. I'll do it again today. Breasts are actually feeling slightly firmer. Other than that, no changes and i have not massaged until tonight. Areola are still dark.I've also measured back half inch bigger in the hips @37"! Was not expecting that. My mom made a comment on how big my but was the other day. I did not put it together till I literally looked in the mirror and somehow I looked thicker in the thighs. My bust measured 36 n 3/4". It must be pm.

This may be my last day on pm.

My 1st day on 200 mg PM dose (am) as well as placenta c jelly that I scored from a small Japanese store here where I liveSmile

12/23 (D15)
My first day on preg 50mg. Hopefully that helps. I hope to the heavens my Areola don't expand. I have what looks to be thickening nipples. The Areolas are darker now! On the left, its more and there's a velvetyness around the nipple. I noticed this yesterday. But as far as size, my measurements have shrunk for some reason. I think my breasts are dropping? I'm busting out of my bra so what else could it be?

12/25 (D17)
I think I'll do 25mg am/pm and Half placenta c jelly with sp and pm in the morning. SP at night. Have not pumped or massaged lately. No protein or l-arg. Just being lazy for the holidays.
Did am massage with aloe/arg. Did 100mg of pm. A few ovarian aches but no breast aches. It's weird. My breast measurements are dropping! I'm 36.25" I believe it's actual shifting of the breasts as they grow, they seem to drop a bit downward toward the ribcage. And since I'm very broad (as going up from the underbust), its narrowing as growth continues down.

DEC 28 (Day 20)
I pumped for a good hr . I'm still dropping in measurement! 36" I look in the mirror I seem like my breasts are lower slung. It's bizarrely strange. Either I shrunk or I'm shifting here. I did aloe massage again. I put very little pc on.

12/29 (day 21)
I am set to be done with pm dosing in the next 2 days.

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