[Charlie_girl]

Way to go, Lotus!! I back you 100%! Thank you for posting that.

Cherrymennos post (below) is so full of incorrect statements, it's rediculous. I was going to come back and correct them, but I'm glad you post that. Much better than I would have done

Cherry- to sum it up for you again, do your research before ranting away. You lose all credibility when you're just emotional, pissy, don't fully know what you're talking about, don't actually read replies, and get mad when everyone just tries to help you realize that what you're wanting to do is dangerous and unnecessary.

I am going to ignore all of the comments about being crazy or PMSing because I came with a new idea and experiences with something that is obviously unique to this website and nobody cared. That would hurt my feelings at any time. Some women avoid confrontation and sulk at being ignored, some get offended and vocal. Sorry, not sorry!

None of you have used this kind of supplement before. And how many of you have had your GH tested before supplementation with these "natural" substances you speak of and then went and got GH tested after supplementation?

Also, many of you are on hormonal birth control, no different from a man taking steroids. BC=female equivalent of steroids. If testosterone makes men more manly, and hormonal BC makes women more womanly, tell me what the difference is? If these girls' goals were to take the natural safe road, they wouldn't take the man-made hormones, right? I don't know who your Felicia troll is, but you must have pissed her off if you are expecting her to pose as some rabble-rouser.

[cherrymennos]

Realize I only got pissy, and ceased to care about what any of you thought after being completely ignored. Not even trying to earn credibility because that would mean I still cared what anyone thought on here. I have done all of this research before, not desiring to re-research and post it on here. You all have internet and I assumed you could look things up for yourself. I have tried all three of these peptides and know the effects and possible side effects. I know the difference between Test and Est, and the possible side effects from taking either as a supplement. My assertion is that hormonal birth control is no different or more natural than supplementing with Testosterone. Hormone therapy is hormone therapy, whether your doctor gives it to you or if you give it to yourself. Honestly I think anyone who supplements with Hormonal Female Birth Control is taking a greater risk, due to the connection between that kind of BC and Breast Cancer. While it raises the risk of this kind of cancer, GH only makes cancer grow IF you happen to have cancer during GHRP supplementation. Why raise your GH by natural means at all, if you are afraid of cancer?

[Dynseli]

You overreacted, big time. People weren't intentionally ignoring your posts. They respond to what they find interesting, or what is recent when they log in. I have very few threads, and I mostly want people to read them, than to bury the information behind many pages of responses. If its important, and insightful, add to it.

I don't associate with direct supplementation of GH because it reminds me of what Mark McGuire, Sammy Sosa, A Rod and other cheater athletes do. This is what I have on GH, http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles...A003178F2/ . Apart from that, I see GH as restarting puberty, while interesting, I have no idea what that does. My guess is that GH would cause some progress, then a quick (negative feedback) plateau. As with any hormone, I am against direct supplementation, there are herbs that stimulate the body in to producing hormones, or react with specific receptors. Of the top of my head, herbs that raise LH ?might? consequently raise GH.

From my studies: insulin like growth factor 1 (IGF-1) receptors, prolactin receptors, estrogen receptor alpha, and progesterone receptor B and the natural hormones that regulate them are most important.

There might be few other receptors like Calcium Sensing receptor, which is only known to be useful during breastfeeding, and receptors that are in breast connective tissue that are also available in most other connective tissues.

As for injections, no one is qualified to do that. Who has gone to medical school for enough years, and is meticulous about their research? Even then, that's what professional athlete steroid pusher do; while they may be good at what they do, may be meticulous about their study and use good quality control, who knows what was involved in where they got their ingredients, and its illegitimate; no body audits their process. A body reacts differently to ingesting something, and taking a shot: what may be safe to eat, may be deadly subcutaneously.

EVERYONE is behind on NBE research, and cosmetic surgeons did a lot to keep it that way

In any subject, there is a lot of arrogance when many call themselves a professional (so they can say that to discredit everyone else without merit), and they're nothing more than pompous. However, injection might be an outcome of the future, where instead of a useless plastic surgeon, a licensed pharmacist would give a noninvasive depot shot.

[Dynseli]

You do realize? androgen supplementation causes quick negative feedback, and a plateau. It works for a short time to make noticeable effects, then desensitizes the receptors so they don't respond any more.

The body producing high levels of progesterone is natural. It's what happens during pregnancy to prevent the fetus from being lost. It has been prescribed by real doctors for birth control, or to prevent menstrual problems. So supplementing with Progesterone cream, or birth control is actually not far fetched. Taking steroids, on the other hand, is what gives people muscle, but then they have hormonal problems after that. Topical androgens have been prescribed, but that's not ingested steroids. And topical androgens do desensitize receptors too. Any direct hormone desensitizes receptors.

Direct GH supplementation, is that what causes the pituitary to not be able to produce as much of its own GH anymore?

[Dynseli]

The posted link shows Glucocorticoid receptor (GR) and Growth Hormone receptor (GHR) having an involvement.

Prolactin Receptor (PrlR), Progesterone Receptor B (PRB), Estrogen Receptor alpha (ERα) and Insulin Growth like factor 1 (IGF-1) are directly involved.

[cherrymennos]

Lovely11,
I appreciate your thoughtful responses and the information provided. I really wanted to have a conversation about this topic and not get angry at being ignored, which 65 views and not even a pip made me believe was happening. All I saw was non-informational, feel-good or fantasizing topics getting responses on this portion of the site, I certainly wish I had just walked away and not posted again instead of venting my feelings.

I have known men who supplemented with Anabolic and Androgenic Steroids and you are absolutely correct, they start with a small dose and have to continue upping their intake as their body gets used to the amount injected. They inject to protect their liver from being damaged. Many of the men I have known personally were medically trained to perform injections, being Firefighters/EMTs. All really healthy, great guys who were not at all the crazy meatheads with a slew of steroid induced medical problems suggested by popular media, or the FDA in general. I would suggest watching "Bigger, Stronger, Faster" to understand more about what guys like this are really like. Most people just watch media stories about performance enhancers and believe these guys are stupid and reckless assholes/cheaters. There is so much more we are never told. These also had methods of taking the HGH that would not lower their natural productions, such as taking it at low doses every 3-5 days instead of every day.

HGH is something that most professional athletes take, not just the ones who got caught. This is a fact that many people do not want to face. It's sad that some started doing it, and combined with the difficulty in dope-testing for HGH, this makes it so that the only true level playing field is the one where +90% of professional athletes take it. IGF-1, for example is the compound that HGH turns into when it is released in your body, and many simply take this, including one of the Firefighters I know. He said it actually worked better than the HGH. This is impossible to test for. I don't judge the athletes who take this, as they are simply keeping up with the rest of their competitors, and they will continue to do so until real testing procedures are made available to keep everyone clean.

Thanks so much,
Cherry

[uhuccup]

Cherry, I don't think you're really interested in hearing other opinions. You want to have your opinion approved. Sorry to say that, but it seems like you're only getting a bit angry and want to convince them, if someone disagrees withyou.

[Dynseli]

The injection thing was a turnoff. There are a lot of people on this thread who did say important and relevant stuff on here. That didn't seem to be addressed. I don't believe in using GH directly, perhaps herbs that influence it, but still that has a limit. Progesterone, estrogens, IGF-1, prolactin and their herbal mimics are the hormones that act directly. No one here is qualified to advocate injections, so no one can respond in relation to that. It looks like the injection method is hearsay rather than going through the actual research. I've seen a discovery channel episode (whether or not it was fiction based on reality) where a steroid supplier to professional athletes, tested it on himself as his quality control. While it does look stringent, I do not know where he got it from, and their ethical practices (but I could say the same thing about some brick and mortar stores).

The people on this thread pointed out there are more important hormones and mimics for NBE. They've pointed out that GH was discussed on BN. Lotus wrote a lot of information on GH, and Charlie_girl said a lot of insightful things. What's the point of increasing GH without the presence of the phytohormones that affect the receptors in the breasts, or the phytohormones that influence human hormones that do this? My research also shows there are more important hormones than GH. I don't see research that says if GH directly interacts with breasts, so how is that supposed to work on its own. The people who did the research on GH injections didn't even look into this, or they weren't looking into NBE research. It's also a shortcut to bypass what they don't understand.

I understand that GH is a way to restart puberty, but that is uncharted water. And it is a limited result. I think taking an injection would be harder on the liver than ingesting it. Whereas the intestines can clear out more of anything hard on the liver, and gradually introduce the substance to the body. Digestion is why snake venom is deadly if injected, but its not deadly if ingested. This is like why a harmless product fed to a test animal won't kill it, but an injection is more than 4 times more likely to kill it.

Men generally have more muscle gain in their upper body because of their natural testosterone, not because of dedication.

There is no burden to prove your point, but if you want people to believe you, there is burden for you to show us where you got the information or where to find it. Losing track of an important article can sometimes become a needle in a haystack. As for me, my standards are NLM, science news, encyclopedias, professional websites,

[Dynseli]

Another supporting case.
Dr Oz show, he said how vaping drinking alcohol is dangerous, because the body has no way to reject it, to prevent an overdose. If someone drinks alcohol, they can vomit it, as a safety measure to prevent intoxication and death. To tell you the truth it would take a lot of alcohol to do that, while other substances can be more dangerous in tiny amounts. The potential for dangerous injections is much higher than vapeing drinking alcohol, more concentrated. No way to vomit it. The body already produces a certain alcohol, so its intoxication and further that are concerns with that.

[Dynseli]

My hypothesis is, if choosing to increase GH, it should only be done once per cycle. The time is before or during ovulation, but I am unsure of which. Outside of supplementing, only stick with healthy foods so your body can make the GH it needs from that.

LH kickstarts ovulation sooner, and I think GH has an effect on LH. Your research left out a lot of needed information: IE about cycles, hormone levels, breast cell receptors, hormone imbalances, LH causing overfertility then lowered infertility age. How estrogens and progestins are completely different classes of hormones.

Growth can happen during menstruation due to IGF-1 and prolactin.
More growth happens during luteal due to both high progesterone, and high but less estrogen. It is important that androgens are down, especially during luteal phase.

Total Height and breast size Together is due to GH. And GH is associated with high IGF-1 which is directly responsible for growth during follicular. The link to this study is at the top of the thread http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=21105
Other hormones are more important than GH. GH so far is a nonfactor during the luteal phase. GH alone would only increase bust size proportionally to body size.