[SunnyPalms]

Hello,

Newbie here. I've been lurking on this website for a few months now and have done LOTS of research on here (nothing short of reading almost EVERY post clear back to the beginning) and on other websites. I have developed my own routine and decided to start keeping better track of it by starting my own program page.

I started at the end of August, 2012. I started out with taking 1725 mg daily of saw palmetto, fenugreek, and red clover. Massaged twice daily with wild yam extract or fenugreek extract mixed with lotion. Ramped up in the second month, then took a two week break. Switched out red clover for wild yam.

Stats:
Female
5' 6"
110 lbs
33 1/2" across bust
28" under bust
35" hips
32B

Current program:

2000 mg of SP, Fenugreek, and WY (Greenbush)
Massage twice daily

I have had up to an inch of swelling, but so far no solid growth. I have taken the online hormone test on Dr. Lee's website and I feel that my hormones have been balanced out very well. HOWEVER, I think the herbs have caused excessive estrogen in my system because I have been experiencing frequent migraine headaches, which I haven't gotten since I went off birth control five years ago. So I have lowered my dose and hopefully this will balance back out again. If I get one more migraine, I will take a break and do a cleanse and start out again small. The first month when I was on the lower dose I did really well and had lots of tingles and pain, then good swelling in the second month, but NO signs of too much estrogen. Since I have upped the dosage though, these signs of growth have somewhat subsided. So maybe the lower dose is best for me.

I don't really have any specific goal in mind in terms of inches. I would just like to fill out a little better. I am pretty thin and am hoping to put on a little bit of lean muscle weight around my thighs/butt.

So I know growth is slow during winter time. I'm just gonna keep going with it though cause what do I have to lose? I am going to try to continue this until the beginning of February, as long as I don't feel like it is causing a hormonal imbalance. If I can continue and by that time I have NO growth I may end up trying BO. By the beginning of February I will have given the herbs six months.

I will keep my thread posted.

[SunnyPalms]

My migraines have continued so I have stopped taking my herbs. I am currently only doing massage with borage oil mixed with lotion, or just lotion sometimes. I have been wracking my brain trying to figure out the problem. I think I may be having a reaction to wild yam. The migraines seemed to have started after I began using WY, and I didn't have any problems when I was using fenugreek, SP, and RC. I had also been using WY extract mixed with lotion for massage, but stopped because it kept making me itchy, which I thought was just the alcohol in the extract irritating my skin. Then one day when I used it for massage and I immediately broke out in hives.

SO, hopefully that's all it is and I can just get back to my program and replace WY with something else. I think I will do a milk thistle cleanse to get it all out of my system before starting again.

I've learned so much from this forum and everyone's experiences! Feel free to leave any comments or suggestions.

[Mono]

Those migraines sounds like you've got estrogen dominance. I experienced that too for 2 weeks. I'd recommend you to stop everything for a few days even massage with extracts. Your body will clean the excess hormones itself you don't need to do a cleanse.

[Lady32C]

I agree with Mono, also go back to your lower dose. It took me 4 months to figure out the reason I had stopped growing was because I had been taking too much of my herbs. A week after I lowered my dose my breasts went right back to growing.

[SunnyPalms]

I was kind of thinking that too, that maybe I could have excess estrogen. Is a few days a long enough break though? I have stopped all herbs and I'm wanting to start back in the next few days (when I start my cycle.)

[Lady32C]

Yea a few days is a perfectly fine amount of time.

[SunnyPalms]

I started back on my herbs last week. Still using my greenbush kit, taking one fenugreek and saw palmetto three times a day, plus around 800 mg a day of red clover. I decided to drop the wild yam because I know my body and I believe I was having a negative reaction to it for some reason. I'll see how I do on this dose for a little but, then maybe I'll ramp up if I see NOTHING. I am massaging with FSO and borage oil twice a day.

Every morning I get some swelling but have yet to see any real growth. I guess this is gonna be slow and steady wins the race. But I've got patience!

[Lacey Ra]

Try doing Flaxseed Oil massages, the Omega 3's help plump the fat in your breast, it's increases swelling meaning increased circulation and is great at growing breasts. You can use Camelina oil if you don't like Flaxseed oil or Fish oil. but I'd give Flaxseed a fair shot first.

[SunnyPalms]

Thanks for the suggestion! I have actually recently started doing massages with flaxseed oil because of all the positive feedback I've seen on here and thus far I have gotten some pretty good swelling from it! My boobs always look great in the morning from my massage + heating pad the night before. Then when I take my bra off at the end of the day, it's back to normal. I'll definately keep doing the flaxseed oil massages and see what happens.

[SunnyPalms]

Just updating. Started back on my herbs. I was one them for one week...then got another migraine. I have also been feeling super tired lately. Something isn't right so I have stopped taking them yet again. I am on such a low dose, I don't understand how I can be becoming estrogen dominant. 1725 mg today isn't that much. I read on the Dr. Lee website that you can become estrogen dominant even if you have low estrogen, but even lower progesterone. So maybe my progesterone levels are too low?? I'm taking all these phytoestrogens, but nothing is boosting my progesterone.

Sooooo I've done some research these last few days. I'm thinking maybe I will use PC the two weeks leading up to my period, then start taking the herbs again and see what happens. A basis I have for believing that this may work: I started my NBE journey with preparing my body with PC. Then I started on the herbs, and used them for two and a half months with NO side effects, even after I ramped up to over 3,000 mg per day. I took a break then and once I started back up again (replaced RC with WY) it has been nothing but problems. Maybe the progesterone effects helped balance out the estrogen effects, but now it's worn off? Maybe the WY messed me up and I can't get it back to normal? Maybe I'm losing it, but I can't figure out any other reasons why this is happening.

We will see what happens with the progesterone cream. I am open to suggestions, as always.