[kiwi34]

Hi everyone!

Once again, I have been MIA for a couple of weeks. Sorry for the lack of updates. School has been taking over my life as well as my two jobs so its been hectic.

I need to make some changes. I realized that I cannot follow an herbal regimen because it makes me break out! As AbiDrew pointed out before, I could be having a reaction to Fenugreek, and just a few days ago, I stopped the herbs altogether. As I mentioned in my last post, I was breaking out like crazy and my skin was SUPER oily. Already my face is beginning to clear up from the nasty breakouts that I had for 3 weeks straight. Unfortunately I already have some scarring from the breakouts...and they stand out since my skin had been relatively clear and acne free for most of my 23 years.

But oh well, at least I tried it and now I know that if I were to do another herbal regimen, I'd have to switch the FG out for something else. I want to give my skin a chance to clear up before I start researching other herbs to try. Another unfortunate thing was that I had actually started to get a bit of swelling on the second week of the herbs. They still looked the same in the mirror but I could tell that they felt different in my hands when I would massage them. By week 3, I had lots of soreness, and whether that was from PMS or the herbs, I am not sure, but I can also say that now that I've been off of the herbs for almost a week, my boobs have deflated.

In the meantime, today actually, I took a leap and ordered 5 months worth of Ainterol PM from Ebay. I feel really embarrassed that I didn't give the herbs enough time to do their magic, but I just could not stand the break outs. I was really sad that my clear skin was being messed up by herbs, so that was kind of a deal breaker for me.

With that being said, I am finishing up my period right now, so when the PM gets here, I will decide how I want to cycle them. I've seen that some users start it on Day 1 of their period and some start the day after their periods end, so I will have to do some research to see what would benefit my body the most. I still have bottles of FG, SP, and Hops, so maybe I can find a way to incorporate some of that into the PM program too. So many things to think about!

Just wanted to share that with everyone. I hope that all of you are getting closer to your goals!

Happy Boobing!

[EdithHooters97]

I'm going to be starting PM for the first time too. (And I was also breaking out from the FG/WY combo, I think.

Just want to point out that PM is also an herb remember. A reallyyyyyy powerful one. I'm hoping it will not make me break out, though I heard it can at first-- Like the first month. So we'll see. I hope it doesn't make you break out either.

For now I'm just taking SP and it's been really good. I will continue to take it with the PM. Don't know how I'm going to cycle it either. I think I might start it after my period for the first month, and then on recurring months start on day 1. I read that was a good way to do it..

[kiwi34]

I'm going to be starting PM for the first time too. (And I was also breaking out from the FG/WY combo, I think.

Just want to point out that PM is also an herb remember. A reallyyyyyy powerful one. I'm hoping it will not make me break out, though I heard it can at first-- Like the first month. So we'll see. I hope it doesn't make you break out either.

For now I'm just taking SP and it's been really good. I will continue to take it with the PM. Don't know how I'm going to cycle it either. I think I might start it after my period for the first month, and then on recurring months start on day 1. I read that was a good way to do it..

Yeah....as far as PM goes, I am a little bit conflicted. On one hand, I am glad that it a powerful herb because maybe it'll give me the boost that I need to get my boobs growin', but at the same time, I have read some scary things about it messing with your periods and such.

I have also read from many readers that it actually made their skin more clear, so maybe it'll help me clear up whatever remaining break outs I have when I do start up on it! I hope you don't break out either!

Are you getting any results from just being on SP? If so, I might just have to keep that in the plan because I don't want to waste the herbs that I had bought previously. I plan to use whatever I can if it will be compatible with the PM.

[AbiDrew85]

SP certainly isn't incompatible. Lots of the guys over in the Bio Male part of the boards use it to help with blocking their T. In fact, that's what it's for for anyone using it...

I'm not sure if it's NECESSARY for very many bio females, since they really shouldn't have any DHT in the first place, but if you have acne, you probably have DHT, a LITTLE SP can help.

Is your SP powdered whole herb or an extract?

DHT also has this tendency to prevent estrogen from doing things it ought to, even if you have plenty of it. It can keep your breasts small, so for some people, simply blocking their unwanted DHT is all it takes to get a growth spurt or two. It usually doesn't last too long though before they need to add something else.

[kiwi34]

SP certainly isn't incompatible. Lots of the guys over in the Bio Male part of the boards use it to help with blocking their T. In fact, that's what it's for for anyone using it...

I'm not sure if it's NECESSARY for very many bio females, since they really shouldn't have any DHT in the first place, but if you have acne, you probably have DHT, a LITTLE SP can help.

Is your SP powdered whole herb or an extract?

DHT also has this tendency to prevent estrogen from doing things it ought to, even if you have plenty of it. It can keep your breasts small, so for some people, simply blocking their unwanted DHT is all it takes to get a growth spurt or two. It usually doesn't last too long though before they need to add something else.

AbiDrew...so you're saying that if I had DHT, which I very well might considering my body hair, a low dosage of SP could be beneficial and in some cases it could even help promote breast growth when used alone? I don't know if I should try it or just wait a few weeks until I start on PM and just try that out for a while.

Thank you for letting me know that the two are not compatible together though!

[AbiDrew85]

Thank you for letting me know that the two are not compatible together though!

Uhm. I don't know if this was a typo on your part, or a misunderstanding... They ARE compatible. Intentional full negative wording can be confusing, I understand, since it's becoming so common these days that people use it accidentally.

SP does have a phytoestrogen, but it doesn't compete strongly and is very miniscule in amount, so it won't have any impact on stronger intentional phytoestrogens such as PM.

And yeah, SP can give a small bit of growth for some people all on it's own simply by blocking the DHT which was blocking the bodies E. It did for me, I'm pretty well almost certain that the soy I was taking previously had little to nothing to do with my sudden bit of boob last year before starting things seriously this year.

Excess body hair in females isn't always because of excess testosterone, though. Sometimes it's excess progesterone. Sometimes it's pseudohyperaldosteronism. Sometimes it's real hyperaldosteronism.

IMO, look each of these things up and decide for sure if you think you have excess testosterone, or progesterone, or hyperaldosteronism-like symptoms. Then if the lattermost, try to determine if it's pseudo or the real deal. Which might be harder to do without a hormone test.

Then you should treat accordingly. If excess T, then you'll want to use a T-blocker, SP is an excellent one, if excess P, then you'll want to use an estrogen supplement at the appropriate time in your cycle, if hyperaldosteronism, you'll want to suppress aldosterone, if pseudo, then you'll have to talk to a doctor, that's almost impossible to treat without prescription. You can try to suppress symptoms, but you can't actually treat the condition except through prescription.

[kiwi34]

"SP certainly isn't incompatible."

Uhm. I don't know if this was a typo on your part, or a misunderstanding... They ARE compatible. Intentional full negative wording can be confusing, I understand, since it's becoming so common these days that people use it accidentally.

Haha. oh my gosh I feel so dumb right now. You're right, I completely read that wrong lol. Thank you for listing all of those possibilities for me to research! You are so educated on this process and I feel really lucky that you respond to my posts to help lead me in the right direction!

So I looked up the possibilities, and the one that seemed the most likely was excess progesterone according to this website:

http://www.livestrong.com/article/257337...gesterone/

It listed all of the symptoms, and I want to say that I exhibit probably 85% of those symptoms, 80% of the time. It would certainly explain the mood swings that I get that aren't even around the time of my periods sometimes, as well as the random cravings here and there! My boyfriend always thinks I am crazy when I get suddenly lethargic and weepy, and I don't blame him, because I also felt that there was something wrong with me, since I didn't know what the actual reason was. When I was on a BCP, I was able to blame it on that, but I haven't been on any BCPs for about 4 years now.

It would also explain the crazy hair loss that I have been experiencing for the last 7 years or so now. I went from losing maybe 50 hairs per day to about 70 just in the shower in the morning plus whatever else I lose throughout the day. Needless to say, I have about 60% of my original hair mass, and people always told me that it was because of a change in diet, and I would always say that I wasn't eating any differently! My doctor also tried to convince me that my change in eating habits was also why I was mysteriously gaining weight, even though I would repeat over and over that my diet was never changed!

After delving back into the symptoms of excess testosterone, I would say that it seems that my case is most likely excess progesterone, as the hairs that I have on my face and body are not coarse, just dark fine hairs.

So I guess my next step is to figure out what I need to take and when, in order to normal out my progesterone levels.

I am always so happy that so many people on this board are vastly more knowledgeable than me AND are willing to help out at the same time! Just wanted to say thanks!

[AbiDrew85]

Aww. Thanks... I'm not entirely sure I deserve it though. I can be awfully wordy and confusing at times. Sometimes I think I explain things more confusingly than the original source material.

Anyway... If excess progesterone is indeed your problem, then all you should need are PM and maaaaaybe maca. Maca I believe you would just take the same dose all month, I think? Someone who uses it correct me if I'm wrong?

PM should be cycled according to your menstrual cycle. Estrogen "peaks" twice in your cycle and falls off slowly and then sharply. The second peak is also not as high as the first.

Many women have reasonable success supplementing with PM for two weeks beginning right after their period, IIRC. Some have tried to be more exacting and hit the peaks and falls. I can't honestly say what might or might not be the "better method". The important thing is to NOT take PM during your period itself and for at least a short time before, otherwise you can seriously mess up your cycle and/or cause abnormally heavy periods.

Since your progesterone is already higher than normal the majority of the time, you shouldn't need to mess with that. Raising your estrogen should by itself correct for the already naturally raised progesterone.

If you DO turn around and start experiencing signs of estrogen dominance, then you can start supplementing progesterone as directed on a good progesterone cream... IMO, everyone should keep some of that stuff handy anyways, just in case.

[kiwi34]

@ AbiDrew... Thanks for all of your info! I am going to stick with just PM for now...I don't know if I want to add the Maca yet, as a lot of people take it to grow some booty and I am okay with mine FOR NOW...we shall see if this booby greed transfers to the butt later...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

So for a quick update...I received my PM in the mail on Oct. 11, and it was really perfect as my period ended on the 10th. Needless to say, I started on the PM right away, with 1 pill on the night of the 11th. I wanted to start out with one pill to see if I would have any adverse effects from it. I did this from the 11-15th.

This morning I decided to add in a morning dose as well, so starting today, I will be taking two PM pills per day. I am going to cycle PM 15 days on and 15 days off. I have not decided if I am going to supplement with anything else on my days off yet, most likely yes, but still to be determined.

So far, nothing out of the ordinary, which is a good thing in my case, seeing as when I was taking the herbs, I had a massive breakout after day 2 or 3. I am really hoping that this means that I will be able to stay on PM for quite a while, or until I can determine whether it is going to work for me or not...keeping my fingers crossed!

I also massage with Ainterol PM Big Breast and Butt Cream. I have been trying to be consistent with it, once in the morning and once at night before bed.

This is my current pill regimen as of today (I feel like I keep updating with these, so I am sorry if anyone gets confused ) :

AM
1 Ainterol PM
1 Collagen
1 Fish Oil
1 Gingko Biloba
1 B-12 vitamin

Afternoon
1 MSM
1 Vit-C

PM
1 Ainterol PM
1 Collagen
1 Hair, Skin, and Nails Vit

I will follow this plan until Day 15, where I will then drop the PM and go from there! If there are any changes within this first cycle, I will definitely be posting pics!

EDIT:
Oh yeah...I forgot to mention...I am also trying to lose about 5-8 lbs...so I am hoping that since I will not be doing any kind of extreme cardio, that it will not mess with my booby growing.

[AbiDrew85]

Looking good to me!

Yeah, besides butt though, maca is also a good just general balancer herb. But if you already have a pretty good butt and don't really want it getting bigger (ME!) then I fully understand NOT including it.

I didn't want to risk either the slight risk of raising my T or the butt increases, I already have a quite large rear compared to the rest of me.