07-03-2011, 14:12
DOES ANYONE KNOW IF YOU CAN TAKE GOAT'S RUE WITH PM? WOULD IT ENHANCE THE GROWING, DO NOTHING OR COUNTERACT IT?
THANKS
THANKS
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07-03-2011, 17:09
Wow Carla,
That was a little bit insensitive. I don't know if you meant to come off sounding like a nasty person but using caps and either calling someone a name or saying that kind of thing makes you sound like a well I'll leave it there.
As for Kaya
Thanks for the help, I have read on the site where I bought my first product from that caffine didn't help promote breast development and I'm just taking that from the site so that's what I went with. I have been trying to do as much research as possible but when you search online you don't usually get a lot of science/medical journals, but you do get more articles promoting products...so I'm doing my best.Thank you for being helpful without being critical...it makes me trust your decision more. I tried e-mailing the product when I got my Pueraria Mirifica from, they weren't as helpful, but I will take less since I don't want to mess with anything. I haven't had any bad side effects yet so that's pretty good. I have been using the cream and serum that I got with the package, but when I'm done I'll look at the other site you sent Thank you again
That was a little bit insensitive. I don't know if you meant to come off sounding like a nasty person but using caps and either calling someone a name or saying that kind of thing makes you sound like a well I'll leave it there.
As for Kaya
Thanks for the help, I have read on the site where I bought my first product from that caffine didn't help promote breast development and I'm just taking that from the site so that's what I went with. I have been trying to do as much research as possible but when you search online you don't usually get a lot of science/medical journals, but you do get more articles promoting products...so I'm doing my best.Thank you for being helpful without being critical...it makes me trust your decision more. I tried e-mailing the product when I got my Pueraria Mirifica from, they weren't as helpful, but I will take less since I don't want to mess with anything. I haven't had any bad side effects yet so that's pretty good. I have been using the cream and serum that I got with the package, but when I'm done I'll look at the other site you sent
Thank you again
07-03-2011, 18:17
What exactly is the undesirable effect of coffee and/or caffeine?
Despite Carlaa's insensitive and unfortunate communication style, I think she is essentially correct. The old saw that coffee and caffeine are deleterious to health is just that, an old wives' tale. I have been unable to find any scientific evidence that caffeine is bad for breast growth. If that were so, guys with gynecomastia would just need to drink more coffee to solve their problem. The closest one can come to evidence that moderate amounts of caffeine are bad is that it is known to pass through the placenta so it is generally recommended that pregnant women abstain since we DON'T KNOW the effects on a developing fetus. That is hardly a statement that it is bad.
Scientific studies have failed to show ANY deleterious effects when ingesting caffeine at moderate levels. If we are talking about coffee, a plethora of new research has found MANY beneficial effects from coffee consumption, even up to 6 cups per day. I don't think we can infer from any of those studies that coffee will promote breast development, but I can't find anything that in any way implies it interferes with breast development.
So, my question again, for Kaya since he/she is making such authoritative assertions, what exactly is the deleterious effect of coffee and caffeine on breast development? I am truly interested in your sources and any info you have on this subject.
Thanks in advance.
Despite Carlaa's insensitive and unfortunate communication style, I think she is essentially correct. The old saw that coffee and caffeine are deleterious to health is just that, an old wives' tale. I have been unable to find any scientific evidence that caffeine is bad for breast growth. If that were so, guys with gynecomastia would just need to drink more coffee to solve their problem. The closest one can come to evidence that moderate amounts of caffeine are bad is that it is known to pass through the placenta so it is generally recommended that pregnant women abstain since we DON'T KNOW the effects on a developing fetus. That is hardly a statement that it is bad.
Scientific studies have failed to show ANY deleterious effects when ingesting caffeine at moderate levels. If we are talking about coffee, a plethora of new research has found MANY beneficial effects from coffee consumption, even up to 6 cups per day. I don't think we can infer from any of those studies that coffee will promote breast development, but I can't find anything that in any way implies it interferes with breast development.
So, my question again, for Kaya since he/she is making such authoritative assertions, what exactly is the deleterious effect of coffee and caffeine on breast development? I am truly interested in your sources and any info you have on this subject.
Thanks in advance.
07-03-2011, 19:10
Re: Caffeine Maybe because it's a diuretic it causes less swelling??? Some say to drink plenty of water. Only a[/align] guess.....
07-03-2011, 19:23
(07-03-2011, 18:17)chrishoney Wrote: What exactly is the undesirable effect of coffee and/or caffeine?
Despite Carlaa's insensitive and unfortunate communication style, I think she is essentially correct. The old saw that coffee and caffeine are deleterious to health is just that, an old wives' tale. I have been unable to find any scientific evidence that caffeine is bad for breast growth. If that were so, guys with gynecomastia would just need to drink more coffee to solve their problem. The closest one can come to evidence that moderate amounts of caffeine are bad is that it is known to pass through the placenta so it is generally recommended that pregnant women abstain since we DON'T KNOW the effects on a developing fetus. That is hardly a statement that it is bad.
Scientific studies have failed to show ANY deleterious effects when ingesting caffeine at moderate levels. If we are talking about coffee, a plethora of new research has found MANY beneficial effects from coffee consumption, even up to 6 cups per day. I don't think we can infer from any of those studies that coffee will promote breast development, but I can't find anything that in any way implies it interferes with breast development.
So, my question again, for Kaya since he/she is making such authoritative assertions, what exactly is the deleterious effect of coffee and caffeine on breast development? I am truly interested in your sources and any info you have on this subject.
Thanks in advance.
Hey , Thanks so much for recognizing carla's communication skills! What was all that about? lol.
Regarding your question, i have had great results on PM. Ever since i was given these i was told that caffeine would slow the growth right down. I was not told to stop drinking Tea or Coffee, but to reduce my intake. It is advised not to drink caffeine an hr after taking a capsule and to cut down on chocolate intake
But, the results have been good. I have just done as i have been advised. Caffeine when taken in large amounts, can actually counteract the effects of natural breast enlarging supplements due to their diuretic (water ridding) nature, and the tendency to speed up the metabolism of nutrients and calories, which may hinder the very natural breast enhancement process that you are trying to achieve. I have known many who have had better results when they cut the caffeine down. Don't give it up , just cut back the big amounts. Its very surprising how much caffeine we consume HuGZzz
KAYA
08-03-2011, 07:06
(This post was last modified: 08-03-2011, 07:16 by chrishoney.)
Did you ever think to ask why "it is advised not to drink caffeine"? My point is that this is simply parroting a belief about coffee and caffeine that is not supported by any research. Those beliefs are simply old wives tales and myth. Try as I might, I fail to see how your arguments are based on good science or even plausible theory based on good science.
The diuretic rationale doesn't hold water (pun intended) since it is even questionable whether their is a net loss of water from drinking coffee. Remember, you are drinking flavored water (coffee) to ingest the caffeine that way. Additionally, the body does not loose water from only certain tissues, sparing others. That's not how fluid and electrolyte balance is maintained in the circulatory system and tissues. That is mediated by the kidneys utilizing a complex, systemic, hormonal feedback system. Dehydration does not begin to significantly affect basic energy metabolism until water loss becomes quite extreme. Mild diuretic effects are easily compensated for by shifting interstitial fluid throughout the entire body (not just the breasts) back into the circulatory system, and in normal life by increased thirst. Additionally, since the breasts, especially in males, make up a small percentage of the body mass, there is no way that any diuretic effect would significantly decrease breast volume unless we are talking about a life threatening loss of water, which obviously coffee does not create.
Where did you ever get the idea that caffeine speeds up the metabolism of nutrients and calories? I think I know what you mean by this, but if that were the case, there would not be an obesity problem in this country with the amount of coffee and cola consumed per capita. Caffeine and coffee does NOT have this effect. Think about this, if caffeine had such an effect on the body's overall metabolism rate, there would NOT be a multibillion dollar diet 'industry.' Many, many diet pills over the years contained caffeine but ALL failed to have any meaningful effect on weight loss. If it did have an effect, any overweight person would merely have to increase their caffeine intake. Obviously, that's not working for weight loss, so how will it hinder breast development?
For the sake of your argument, if caffeine does mysteriously "speed up the metabolism of nutrients and calories", by what metabolic pathway does this occur, and by what metabolic process or pathway does it hinder breast development?
I am interested in real research based on real science (human physiology) with repeatable results. I would even be interested in hearing plausible theories. After all, NBE is NOT supported by by conventional, medical wisdom (notice I did not say knowledge) but we all believe/hope it works based largely on our own experiences backed up by plausible theories.
I had a similar discussion with another obstreperous user of this forum whose only proof was that she "knew" cutting out caffeine in her own diet had allowed her bust to increase, and therefore that would be the case for everyone, and coffee and caffeine were bad for you because that was what she had always heard. That's not even bad science; in fact, it's not even science at all. It's just opinion and the utter fallibility of opinion in combination with the tunnel vision of our own biases in describing reality is the main reason we do research in the first place. There are just as many testimonials from others here on breastnexus and other NBE sites who state they have achieved great results while still consuming as much coffee as they desired. Which of these "others" are right, the ones you know, or the ones I know? Give me a break. There was a time when "everyone knew" the sun revolved around the earth and the earth was flat, despite good scientific theory that said otherwise.
Let's talk about the plausible mechanism of how caffeine supposedly does this. Again, all the recent research on caffeine and coffee fails to find any evidence of impaired health from either coffee or caffeine, and in fact, finds substantial health benefits from both. How can the rest of the body benefit from coffee and caffeine, but breast development is hindered? What plausible mechanism "counteracts" NBE? I'd love to hear it if there is one.
The diuretic rationale doesn't hold water (pun intended) since it is even questionable whether their is a net loss of water from drinking coffee. Remember, you are drinking flavored water (coffee) to ingest the caffeine that way. Additionally, the body does not loose water from only certain tissues, sparing others. That's not how fluid and electrolyte balance is maintained in the circulatory system and tissues. That is mediated by the kidneys utilizing a complex, systemic, hormonal feedback system. Dehydration does not begin to significantly affect basic energy metabolism until water loss becomes quite extreme. Mild diuretic effects are easily compensated for by shifting interstitial fluid throughout the entire body (not just the breasts) back into the circulatory system, and in normal life by increased thirst. Additionally, since the breasts, especially in males, make up a small percentage of the body mass, there is no way that any diuretic effect would significantly decrease breast volume unless we are talking about a life threatening loss of water, which obviously coffee does not create.
Where did you ever get the idea that caffeine speeds up the metabolism of nutrients and calories? I think I know what you mean by this, but if that were the case, there would not be an obesity problem in this country with the amount of coffee and cola consumed per capita. Caffeine and coffee does NOT have this effect. Think about this, if caffeine had such an effect on the body's overall metabolism rate, there would NOT be a multibillion dollar diet 'industry.' Many, many diet pills over the years contained caffeine but ALL failed to have any meaningful effect on weight loss. If it did have an effect, any overweight person would merely have to increase their caffeine intake. Obviously, that's not working for weight loss, so how will it hinder breast development?
For the sake of your argument, if caffeine does mysteriously "speed up the metabolism of nutrients and calories", by what metabolic pathway does this occur, and by what metabolic process or pathway does it hinder breast development?
I am interested in real research based on real science (human physiology) with repeatable results. I would even be interested in hearing plausible theories. After all, NBE is NOT supported by by conventional, medical wisdom (notice I did not say knowledge) but we all believe/hope it works based largely on our own experiences backed up by plausible theories.
I had a similar discussion with another obstreperous user of this forum whose only proof was that she "knew" cutting out caffeine in her own diet had allowed her bust to increase, and therefore that would be the case for everyone, and coffee and caffeine were bad for you because that was what she had always heard. That's not even bad science; in fact, it's not even science at all. It's just opinion and the utter fallibility of opinion in combination with the tunnel vision of our own biases in describing reality is the main reason we do research in the first place. There are just as many testimonials from others here on breastnexus and other NBE sites who state they have achieved great results while still consuming as much coffee as they desired. Which of these "others" are right, the ones you know, or the ones I know? Give me a break. There was a time when "everyone knew" the sun revolved around the earth and the earth was flat, despite good scientific theory that said otherwise.
Let's talk about the plausible mechanism of how caffeine supposedly does this. Again, all the recent research on caffeine and coffee fails to find any evidence of impaired health from either coffee or caffeine, and in fact, finds substantial health benefits from both. How can the rest of the body benefit from coffee and caffeine, but breast development is hindered? What plausible mechanism "counteracts" NBE? I'd love to hear it if there is one.
Hi Chrishoney , Thanks for your super long post !
To put it brief, My advice is not to overload on caffeine, its also called "common sense" Also i never started a post about caffeine, so i don't know why your going to extreme lengths to get your opinion across? I only have the knowledge i have been given by so many others with great success story''s.
Make yourself a capo and relax.
HuGZzz
KAYA
To put it brief, My advice is not to overload on caffeine, its also called "common sense" Also i never started a post about caffeine, so i don't know why your going to extreme lengths to get your opinion across? I only have the knowledge i have been given by so many others with great success story''s.
Make yourself a capo and relax.
HuGZzz
KAYA
OK now I see why some take so many mg-s. I know for sure there is several strengths of Pueraria Mirifica and it depends on what part of the root they use and when it's harvested. 100Kg roots gives 10kg good stuff. Several people I know of that uses PM from this UK site says it's PM from China and it's made of the bad 90Kg left over from manufacturing. In this way sure you can take 2000 mg a day without problems. Not only that, I also heard it's useless and maybe not even real Pueraria Mirifica at all because the real PM is sold out of Thailand.
Now why is it so? It's because both UK links are all fake companies or not active companies at all, which means no responsibilities. Both is P.o.Boxes!!! and the other has these data taken from http://www.companieshouse.gov.uk
Status: Active
Date of Incorporation: 30/06/2008
Country of Origin: United Kingdom
Company Type: Private Limited Company
Nature of Business (SIC(03)):
7499 - Non-trading company
Accounting Reference Date: 30/06
Last Accounts Made Up To: 30/06/2010 (DORMANT)
Next Accounts Due: 31/03/2012
Last Return Made Up To: 30/06/2010
Next Return Due: 28/07/2011
Note that even for 2010 it says Non-Trading Company and DORMANT which means the company is not trading!!!... but since they have a live website, it's better to get the tax people to look into this.
But listen to this... BOTH ARE PAYING TO HIDE their ownership details on WhoIS... Does it ring a bell by now? They are HIDING!
All I'm saying is don't be fooled by fake stuff, buy the real thing from Thailand as there is good companies there that actually are registered and operational companies with real people you can talk to. Best of all, they sell the best quality Pueraria Mirifica you can get as Chiang Mai is the place where the root grows. It's good, it's clean and it's safe!
Since I use the herbs from Anne Selene named MiroHealth I can 100% recommend them as well as their service but doing a search on the net for companies in Thailand you surely find more then Anne Selene but as in China as in Thailand you will find low-cost non-working PM.
For me PM has worked very well and I know I'm safe because the products from Anne Selene are documented clean and treated to avoid fungus, mold and microorganism in the herbal capsules.
Be smart, think twice before you buy from eBay, UK and China because it's more likely the same!!!!
Now why is it so? It's because both UK links are all fake companies or not active companies at all, which means no responsibilities. Both is P.o.Boxes!!! and the other has these data taken from http://www.companieshouse.gov.uk
Status: Active
Date of Incorporation: 30/06/2008
Country of Origin: United Kingdom
Company Type: Private Limited Company
Nature of Business (SIC(03)):
7499 - Non-trading company
Accounting Reference Date: 30/06
Last Accounts Made Up To: 30/06/2010 (DORMANT)
Next Accounts Due: 31/03/2012
Last Return Made Up To: 30/06/2010
Next Return Due: 28/07/2011
Note that even for 2010 it says Non-Trading Company and DORMANT which means the company is not trading!!!... but since they have a live website, it's better to get the tax people to look into this.
But listen to this... BOTH ARE PAYING TO HIDE their ownership details on WhoIS... Does it ring a bell by now? They are HIDING!
All I'm saying is don't be fooled by fake stuff, buy the real thing from Thailand as there is good companies there that actually are registered and operational companies with real people you can talk to. Best of all, they sell the best quality Pueraria Mirifica you can get as Chiang Mai is the place where the root grows. It's good, it's clean and it's safe!
Since I use the herbs from Anne Selene named MiroHealth I can 100% recommend them as well as their service but doing a search on the net for companies in Thailand you surely find more then Anne Selene but as in China as in Thailand you will find low-cost non-working PM.
For me PM has worked very well and I know I'm safe because the products from Anne Selene are documented clean and treated to avoid fungus, mold and microorganism in the herbal capsules.
Be smart, think twice before you buy from eBay, UK and China because it's more likely the same!!!!
08-03-2011, 18:28
(08-03-2011, 16:45)sfem Wrote: coffee and breast volume info: http://www.breastnexus.com/showthread.php?tid=7473
Thanx Sfem
That's a real important piece of information and a good reason to cut down. And because that is a doctors report it stands firm to me. Good stuff
HuGZzz
KAYA
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