[surferjoe2007]

Femina, women metabolize drugs 20-30% quicker then men. The following human study found FG dramatically increases E2 levels in month 2. The amount used in the study was only 300 mg, suggest women need massive amounts is risky. Stick with FG for a few cycles then evaluate. I wouldn't add PM at this point, (if ever). Work on diet, exercise, massage and balancing hormones during break the next few months. Add lemons (sliced) w/ filtered water 6-8 cups per day, which also inhibit androgens.

Thank you for the knowledge and advice! I think I will continue to take fenugreek as I do now along with other non-herbal methods as is recommended, keeping it limited and at a safe intake. Ella Craig gave some very useful advice and suggestions about how it could be used. Surferjoe mentioned that 1-2tbsp was used in the 'most successful programmes', but judging on my age (I'm 18) and what I've read about overdose, isn't that too much? Also, how much would 300mg of fenugreek be in terms of tsp/tbsp? I don't take fenugreek in supplement form. Surely 1tsp is alright? I'm not sure about more seeds = more growth, sounds risky to me as your evidence suggests.

By the way, if it's not too much of a hassle, could you please refer me to a post about cycling? Or just - if you have the time - explain its significance and how to do it? I don't understand what it means and where to find information about it, but I've seen it mentioned a few times on BN already. I'm very bad at using this site, hehe.

At age 18 I'm not certain what a good amount is. Native Americans have given goat's rue, a similar herb, to male children to make them bigger and stronger. But I haven't found much information for female children. I have heard of fenugreek for children in general to increase apetite, but I don't know the amount. Plus you're not a child; puberty is mostly over for you at 18. But it's not quite over. I mean a little should be safe at worst. If you really want to be safe and sure you could stay away from herbs until about 22-23 when puberty is totally done. I just know that for fenugreek the dose is way different from other herbs. Studies use 6,000-25,000 mg and I think I saw one diabetes study with around 50,000 mg. Whereas with PM for example studies tend to use 20-200 mg, and most people don't use more than 500-1000 mg. For fenugreek those doses have no effect at all. You can find plenty of information about cycling in the pueraria mirifica forum section. There is about 8,000 mg in a tablespoon. Those fenugreek studies use strong extracts, about 10 times stronger than the whole herb. And pure diosgenin is far about 100 times stronger, though it is missing the other saponins found in fenugreek. I couldn't find the 300 mg study Lotus was referring to in the links btw.

Here are some non-herbal methods:
1. Massage with an oil high in essential fatty acids or saturated such as flax oil or coconut oil. Or both. Eat lots of foods high in essential fatty acids such as seafood.
2. Pectoral muscle exercises. Won't make boobs grow but it makes the muscles underneath larger.
3. Make broth from chicken's feet. It is loaded with collagen which is an important breast material. You can also take 3,000 mg MSM to help your body makes its own collagen, which is simpler but doesn't contain other components of collagen such as hyaluronic acid. Also great for elasticity/firmness.
4. Eat lots of B vitamin rich foods such as whole grains, nuts, beans or bran. Take a multi-B isn't the same, because it is completely missing hundreds of molecules found in food. These vitamins are required for growth, development and hormones in general, like calcium and vitamin D is to bones.
But out of these only massage actually makes boobs grow. 3 & 4 merely allow it if they were the bottleneck holding you back.