19-02-2016, 15:23
Progesterone cream with phytoestrogens included?
February 6 2009 at 5:48 AM
Antheia (Login Antheia)
Hello everyone!
I took a few online tests, such as the Dr. John Lee's hormone test, and I kept coming up with the estrogen dominance result---hooray. I bought some progesterone USP cream, and after I started using it I noticed that the cream I purchased also has phytoestrogens in it. If I am using this cream to try to activate dormant estrogen receptors and achieve hormonal balance, does anyone know if the chances of this occurring are hindered by the fact that phytoestrogens are also in the cream? Or would this even make a difference? My logic may be erroneous, but I would assume that increasing estrogen levels with phytoestrogens may conflict with trying to balance your progesterone levels at the same time.
Also, should phytoestrogens not be consumed at all when one is trying to balance hormones, or should they only be taken on days 1-14 of the cycle, and then progesterone cream on days 15-28 (assuming that one has a 28 day cycle), or does it not matter?
Oh, and one more question, should vitex be taken throughout the course of the NBE journey to promote the body's production of progesterone (is this what it does? I think I read that somewhere), or should it be stopped once a hormonal balance is achieved?
Yikes, maybe I should have split those up, or put a warning in my message title; I wish being tremendously confused was a paid profession...
Thanks for any info!
~Antheia
waxingmoon
(Login waxingmoon)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: Progesterone cream with phytoestrogens included?
February 6 2009, 1:10 PM
Hi Antheia,
Many of the progesterone creams will have phytoestrogens in the mix, but not all. It can be very helpful if a woman is both low in estrogen but lower in progesterone (fairly common in the above 40's group).
Progesterone is fat soluble and easily absorbed through the skin. Estrogen is not easily absorbed through the skin - but some of the phytoestrogen will be absorbed. So it will be a scenario of you having both progesterone and some mild form of estrogen introduced into your system.
Yes your dormant estrogen receptors will be activated, causing an immediate rise in your total body estrogen levels. These phytoestrogens may be able to compete with your body's more potent estrogen for these sites and somewhat reduce the total effect of estrogen rising. Meaning -it is a good thing.
If you do not believe you are one of the estrogen dominant with low estrogen, then for your next batch of progesterone choose a cream that does not have the phytoestrogens. You should be fine with what you have for 2 or 3 cycles. Of course if you think you may be a low estrogen case then continue with this type and it will help to mildly elevate your estrogen.
Now as to your question "should phytoestrogens not be consumed at all when one is trying to balance hormones, or should they only be taken on days 1-14 of the cycle, and then progesterone cream on days 15-28 (assuming that one has a 28 day cycle), or does it not matter?" It depends...
If you use very low dosage phytoestrogens you can fill your receptors to block more potent estrogen from activating them. This would be a job for crushed flaxseed. In this scenario you would take the crushed flaxseed daily. If you want to support you estrogen (raise it) then the idea of using phytoestrogens during days 1 - 14 would make sense. However, even if you want to raise estrogen, watch out for the more potent phytoestrogens. Red clover and licorice are progesterone antagonists - in other words they will fight to reduce your progesterone. A good choice of phytoestrogen for an estrogen dominant woman is fennel.
As for "should vitex be taken throughout the course of the NBE journey to promote the body's production of progesterone, or should it be stopped once a hormonal balance is achieved?" Vitex does raise progesterone levels by acting on the pituitary gland. It creates a state where the body will produce more progesterone from the corpus luteum after ovulation. The only drawback of vitex is that it suppresses prolactin production. Therefore, its use should be limited to what is necessary for hormone balance.
Good luck with your journey. If you want to read my long and rambling account with estrogen dominance then check out my program page.
Best wishes,
waxingmoon
Antheia
(Login Antheia)
waxingmoon, you rock!
February 6 2009, 8:36 PM
Thank you so much for all of that information, waxingmoon, that made a lot of sense and is very helpful! I'm so grateful for the people like you who have been doing NBE for a while, and who have a wealth of knowledge to share with all of us, thanks for helping blaze the trail so that the rest of us can have a smoother journey!
PS--I read about your maca experience, very hilarious I might add, and intriguing. I don't have a huge chest at all, but my booty is even smaller, so I'm going to add maca to my routine to balance it out a bit, as well as some squats. I'll stick to the recommended dosage, though, another lesson learned from waxingmoon! =P (Hopefully I'll avoid the dragon breath, I already smell a bit mapley from the fenugreek in other places...)
Thanks a billion,
~Antheia
February 6 2009 at 5:48 AM
Antheia (Login Antheia)
Hello everyone!
I took a few online tests, such as the Dr. John Lee's hormone test, and I kept coming up with the estrogen dominance result---hooray. I bought some progesterone USP cream, and after I started using it I noticed that the cream I purchased also has phytoestrogens in it. If I am using this cream to try to activate dormant estrogen receptors and achieve hormonal balance, does anyone know if the chances of this occurring are hindered by the fact that phytoestrogens are also in the cream? Or would this even make a difference? My logic may be erroneous, but I would assume that increasing estrogen levels with phytoestrogens may conflict with trying to balance your progesterone levels at the same time.
Also, should phytoestrogens not be consumed at all when one is trying to balance hormones, or should they only be taken on days 1-14 of the cycle, and then progesterone cream on days 15-28 (assuming that one has a 28 day cycle), or does it not matter?
Oh, and one more question, should vitex be taken throughout the course of the NBE journey to promote the body's production of progesterone (is this what it does? I think I read that somewhere), or should it be stopped once a hormonal balance is achieved?
Yikes, maybe I should have split those up, or put a warning in my message title; I wish being tremendously confused was a paid profession...
Thanks for any info!
~Antheia
waxingmoon
(Login waxingmoon)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: Progesterone cream with phytoestrogens included?
February 6 2009, 1:10 PM
Hi Antheia,
Many of the progesterone creams will have phytoestrogens in the mix, but not all. It can be very helpful if a woman is both low in estrogen but lower in progesterone (fairly common in the above 40's group).
Progesterone is fat soluble and easily absorbed through the skin. Estrogen is not easily absorbed through the skin - but some of the phytoestrogen will be absorbed. So it will be a scenario of you having both progesterone and some mild form of estrogen introduced into your system.
Yes your dormant estrogen receptors will be activated, causing an immediate rise in your total body estrogen levels. These phytoestrogens may be able to compete with your body's more potent estrogen for these sites and somewhat reduce the total effect of estrogen rising. Meaning -it is a good thing.
If you do not believe you are one of the estrogen dominant with low estrogen, then for your next batch of progesterone choose a cream that does not have the phytoestrogens. You should be fine with what you have for 2 or 3 cycles. Of course if you think you may be a low estrogen case then continue with this type and it will help to mildly elevate your estrogen.
Now as to your question "should phytoestrogens not be consumed at all when one is trying to balance hormones, or should they only be taken on days 1-14 of the cycle, and then progesterone cream on days 15-28 (assuming that one has a 28 day cycle), or does it not matter?" It depends...
If you use very low dosage phytoestrogens you can fill your receptors to block more potent estrogen from activating them. This would be a job for crushed flaxseed. In this scenario you would take the crushed flaxseed daily. If you want to support you estrogen (raise it) then the idea of using phytoestrogens during days 1 - 14 would make sense. However, even if you want to raise estrogen, watch out for the more potent phytoestrogens. Red clover and licorice are progesterone antagonists - in other words they will fight to reduce your progesterone. A good choice of phytoestrogen for an estrogen dominant woman is fennel.
As for "should vitex be taken throughout the course of the NBE journey to promote the body's production of progesterone, or should it be stopped once a hormonal balance is achieved?" Vitex does raise progesterone levels by acting on the pituitary gland. It creates a state where the body will produce more progesterone from the corpus luteum after ovulation. The only drawback of vitex is that it suppresses prolactin production. Therefore, its use should be limited to what is necessary for hormone balance.
Good luck with your journey. If you want to read my long and rambling account with estrogen dominance then check out my program page.
Best wishes,
waxingmoon
Antheia
(Login Antheia)
waxingmoon, you rock!
February 6 2009, 8:36 PM
Thank you so much for all of that information, waxingmoon, that made a lot of sense and is very helpful! I'm so grateful for the people like you who have been doing NBE for a while, and who have a wealth of knowledge to share with all of us, thanks for helping blaze the trail so that the rest of us can have a smoother journey!
PS--I read about your maca experience, very hilarious I might add, and intriguing. I don't have a huge chest at all, but my booty is even smaller, so I'm going to add maca to my routine to balance it out a bit, as well as some squats. I'll stick to the recommended dosage, though, another lesson learned from waxingmoon! =P (Hopefully I'll avoid the dragon breath, I already smell a bit mapley from the fenugreek in other places...)
Thanks a billion,
~Antheia