29-01-2016, 22:38
To Faerycat - about colagen
March 12 2007 at 5:07 PM Liz (Login Liz1967)
Faery, I'd like to know a few things about colagen:
1 - do you think iy really helps witn NBE along with other herbs?
2 - Do it helps with cellulite and fat in your body, since NBE helps to make you a bit more fat, do you think colagen will help on this?
3 - How long did you take collagen until see some results? How long do you think we must take it?
I'll be very happy if you answer to my questions, please
faerycat
(Login faerycat)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 12 2007, 11:19 PM
Hi Liz,
Ok, in answer to your questions -
1. Yes, it is helping me for sure :-)
2. Not quite sure what you mean on the second question. The calorific value in marine collagen is very little. I should not make you gain any weight. As for filling out cellulite, I'm not sure. Cellulite is like fat being pushed through a string bag which is why it gives the effect of dimpling in the skin. I had a little around my thighs to begin with but it has now disappeared, but then I've recently become a fitness freak and work-out all the time.
3. The experts reckon that it takes a minimum of 6 months to notice the benefits of collagen but I began to see a difference in my face within 6 weeks or so. My boobs are now becoming more meatier too. Length of time to take it? I would say for life, but then that would be up to the individual. I mean, it would be a shame to give up on it when it was giving such good results. Also, after the age of 25, the body makes less and less collagen by itself which is why sagging, wrinkles etc happen. If it is possible to replenish what we can't make and continue to look better/younger for longer, then it has to be worth it........right?
Hope that's answered your questions.
Love
=^_^= x
Liz
(Login Liz1967)
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 13 2007, 10:41 AM
Thanks Faery.
With the second question I wanted to know iff colagen pills can help us to lose that extra wheight that NBE brought to our body.
faerycat
(Login faerycat)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 13 2007, 10:28 PM
Some more info for you Liz -
Description
COLLAGEN - Collagen supplement. Higher Nature CollaFlex Gold, 180 tablets. For joints, skin.
Pure marine collagen for joints . As a vital part of joint cartilage, Collagen is essential for supple and flexible joints. In fact, it is responsible for the shiny surfaces that enable joints to move smoothly and and comfortably.
Researchers believe, however, that we lose approximately 1.5% of our Collagen per year after the age of 25-30. Collaflex Gold provides pure marine collagen, hydrolysed for easy absorption as a nutritional support for joints. It is best taken with a daily multivitamin/mineral and vitamin C.
Directions
Take 3-10 tablets a day with or between meals or as your health professional advises.
A daily mulivitamin/mineral and vitamin C are also recommended.
Nutritional Information
Three tablets typically provide: Collagen Hydrolysate 2100mg (non shark marine sourced) providing Proline, Hydroxyproline,hydroxylysine.
No added sugar, salt, soya, wheat, gluten, yeast, lactose, dairy products, artificial preservatives, colours or flavourings.
Ingredients
Collagen hydrosalate, Lithoamnion calcarea, microcrystalline cellulose, magnesium stearate, hydroxypropyl methylcellulose coating.
Caution
Keep out of the reach of children
Further Information
Collagen is regularly described as the building blocks of the skin. It therefore has a key role to play in creating and maintaining healthy skin all over the body.
It has, however, been scientifically shown that it diminishes at a rate of approximately 1.5% per annum from the age of 25 years onwards. Now it's possible to replenish your body's Collagen without expensive, intrusive injections.
It is, therefore, not surprising that the skins collagen is being replenished through subcutaneous injections. Procedures of this nature seem to be very much on the increase and undoubtedly bring short-term benefits.
The drawbacks are that they only target a small area, they are quite expensive and they need repeating on a regular basis.
Benefits of Collagen
Boosts the bodys collagen production. Smoothes fine lines and wrinkles.
Helps carry oxygen to the skin.
Firms and tones the skin.
Plumps up the skin.
Naturally detoxifies skin tissue. Excellent results with cellulite. Replaces lost elasticity.
What is Collagen?
Collagen is a major structural protein which provides protection and support to soft issues and connects them with the skeleton.
Collagen accounts for approximately 25% of all the protein in the body.
Collagen is the glue that holds the body together.
Collagen is the most abundant structural protein in the body, 75% of the dermis consists of collagen and it accounts for 90% of dermal volume.
Collagen holds the key to healthy skin as it provides the skins strength, resilience and firmness.
Collagen builds scar tissue to assist in healing damaged skin.
The Skin
The Skin is the bodys largest organ and constitutes approximately 15% of its total weight. It is composed of 3 layers - the epidermis, the dermis and the sub-cutaneous tissue. The Dermis, often referred to as the living skin, makes up 90% of the bulk of the skin and 75% of the dermis is collagen.
From the age of 17-25 years the skin starts to age As the skin ages, the dermis becomes thinner and we lose collagen at a rate of approximately 1.5% per annum.
Collagen targets:
Ageing skin.
Wrinkles.
Frown lines.
Crows feet.
Nasal-labial lines.
Under nourished and sun damaged skin. Dry and cracked skin.
Scarring and Wound healing.
It can be taken to enhance the results of these treatments and provide benefits for the whole body.
Collagen is a non-invasive alternative for Botox, collagen injections and similar procedures.
The effects of orally ingested collagen are cumulative.
Face Lifts
There are many face-lift programmes and treatments on the market. These mostly work on the surface of the skin and their effects are temporary.
Collagen works inside the body, all over the body, at the level of the dermis and its effects are cumulative. Collagen can therefore improve the results of face lift treatments.
Weight Management
If taken regularly, collagen can preserve and build and replenish lean muscle mass and encourage the body to shed fat. Collagen may therefore help with inch loss and cellulite.
Pregnant or nursing mothers, and children under 12 should always consult their licensed health professional before taking any supplements.
http://www.elixirhealth.co.uk/asps/ShowDetails.asp?id=1017
So yes, it does appear so help with cellulite and weight loss after all. No wonders mines has disappeared. Lol, and there was me thinking that all my hard efforts down the gym were paying off.
x
faerycat
(Login faerycat)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 13 2007, 10:30 PM
I see they recommed these be taken between meals, but from all the other research I have done.......as well as personal experience, they are really better taken on an empty stomach just before bed time.
x
faerycat
(Login faerycat)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 13 2007, 10:41 PM
Some more info -
Pure Marine Collagen
Natural nutritional protein supplement for optimum health!
- collagen for the creation of skin, muscle, bone and cartilage.
Collagen is the main natural protein that makes up our ligaments, joints, hair, skin and nails, and provides our bodies with structural support. Twenty-five per cent of the dry protein weight of the human body is collagen - the fibrous, elastic, connective tissue in our bodies that holds us together. Seventy-five per cent of our skin is made up of collagen, providing texture, resiliency, and shape; and in total about 30 per cent of our body is collagen. Collagen is the protein that literally holds our skin up.
THE FACE LIFT IN A CAPSULE!
As we age, our body's production of collagen slows down. On the outside we see our skin start to wrinkle and lose its youthful radiance. On the inside we experience this as the weakening of our skeletal structure due to the breakdown of connective tissue, including muscle tissue.
Unfortunately, collagen production reduces by 1.5 per cent per year after the age of 25. So by the time you are 50, your body produces one third less collagen that it did when you left school.
Collagen supplementation is essential to support the body during these natural ageing processes.
Benefits of taking 100% marine collagen:
Boosts collagen production naturally (especially beneficial for stickler syndrome sufferers)
Strengthens nail and hair follicles
Smoothes fine lines and wrinkles & increases the elasticity of the skin
Regenerates lean muscle mass and improves circulation
- due to muscle tissue leaning
Firms and tones
Lose inches where needed and reduce fat mass
Regenerates joints and cartilage
Reduces arthritic pain
Feeds the connective tissues
Improves endurance and vitality
Helps to carry oxygen through the body
Naturally detoxifies
Benefit from a better sleep
Take 100% marine collagen to rejuvenate!
How does 100% marine collagen work?
100% Marine Collagen works from the inside and contains the antioxidant Vitamin C which is an essential co factor in enhancing the action of 100% Marine Collagen. The role of collagen is to nourish the skin from the inside and maintain the highest levels of skin texture through the continuous renewal of its cells, preventing dehydration and minimizing the appearance of wrinkles and stretch marks.
In the first 45 to 90 minutes of sleep your body goes into a repair and rebuild or "rejuvenation" mode. As we grow older, this process slows down. 100% marine collagen is formulated in such a way that it can assist the repair and rebuilding process.
Each capsule = 700mg
30 Capsules = 15 days' supply
60 Capsules = 1 month's supply
180 Capsules = 3 months' supply
Some people experience an improvement after just a few weeks whilst others will need a number of months to see and feel a significant difference. For this reason an initial 3~6 month course is recommended. Increasingly we find that people wish to continue with the collagen after only a few weeks.
http://www.bodyandmindshop.com/product/052.html
x
faerycat
(Login faerycat)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 13 2007, 10:43 PM
Also -
http://www.simply-beautiful.co.uk/simply_collagen_information.htm#collagen2
Scroll all the way down the page.
sophie9
(Login sophie9)
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 14 2007, 3:57 AM
faerycat,
i ordered the three month supply you suggested off of ebay. how much do you take a day? i looked at your program page, and i thought you said you take two. did you start taking that much right away, or did you start off with one pill and decide to boost it to reap more benefits. i ask because it is slightly pricey and has to be ordered from overseas - but if it works, i think it is worth totally worth it. And do you really notice a difference in your lips? that would be great if that happens for me! i have a lip plumper that uses marine collagen.
faerycat
(Login faerycat)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 14 2007, 9:55 AM
Hi Sophie,
Yes, I take 2 x 1000mg caps before bed. Collagen isn't really something you can start off low then ramp up. You would really be wasting your time and money by doing that. You need to get as much of that stuff in as possible.
Some companies recommend that you take an extra capsule (daytime) for the first 3 months or so to get quicker results, then continue with the 2 capsules. It is up to yourself really, but they are expensive. If you can afford it, do it.
Yes too.......big difference in my lips. Lol, they were beginning to fray and shrivel a bit before I started collagen and now they are moist, pouty and meaty again :-D
Don't expect overnight results. It will take time but is worth it.
x
Liz
(Login Liz1967)
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 14 2007, 10:22 AM
Faery were shall I buy colagen in Europe, wich site do you recomend - the better product less expensive.
Anonymous
(Login gingerD)
SENIOR MEMBER
My collagen exp
March 14 2007, 1:12 PM
loads of info there feary nice one!!-glad things r going well-
Have u ordered any of that soap?-i have and cant wait to soap mi sen up-lol
My collagen says take 6 1000mg tabs per day
I take 3, because i simply can not afford to take 6 a day or the tub will get used up quicker.
I take all my meds in 1 go in the morning on an empty stomach
Im 23 i know generally collagen is recco for people 25+ so i don't think i require loads of collagen but i deffinatly think it has helped in my NBE.and i agree i think you sort of have to take it 4eva but i will if i look youthfull 4 eva 2
My skin has greatly improved it took about 6 weeks as feary said,My hair is growing like wild fire at pres the worst roots eva! but i great condition and nails are growing 2,and i also think its helped with plumpage in the breasts however mine could be through collagen massage.
i take collagen +c i got it from ebay-mine is BO though as apposed to marine and it has added vitimin c
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/100-NATURAL-SUPER-COLLAGEN-C-Amazing-250-Tablets_W0QQitemZ130086743910QQcategoryZ33164QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Liz
(Login Liz1967)
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 14 2007, 1:43 PM
Is ti safe to buy pills on e-bay, i means how can I know if it is the real think and not a fraude?
Anonymous
(Login gingerD)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 14 2007, 2:08 PM
well yeh, i mean they come sealed with cotton wool inside the bottles as well,
i understand your causiousness,i dont buy unnamed products,i reaserch the products i see, check they are the same etc and tend to buy from powersellers with alot of good feedback and that sell the same sort of products-i jst find alot of things are cheaper and its easyier, i worry about using my credit card details on other sites,i supose i trust ebay more than other sites.
March 12 2007 at 5:07 PM Liz (Login Liz1967)
Faery, I'd like to know a few things about colagen:
1 - do you think iy really helps witn NBE along with other herbs?
2 - Do it helps with cellulite and fat in your body, since NBE helps to make you a bit more fat, do you think colagen will help on this?
3 - How long did you take collagen until see some results? How long do you think we must take it?
I'll be very happy if you answer to my questions, please
faerycat
(Login faerycat)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 12 2007, 11:19 PM
Hi Liz,
Ok, in answer to your questions -
1. Yes, it is helping me for sure :-)
2. Not quite sure what you mean on the second question. The calorific value in marine collagen is very little. I should not make you gain any weight. As for filling out cellulite, I'm not sure. Cellulite is like fat being pushed through a string bag which is why it gives the effect of dimpling in the skin. I had a little around my thighs to begin with but it has now disappeared, but then I've recently become a fitness freak and work-out all the time.
3. The experts reckon that it takes a minimum of 6 months to notice the benefits of collagen but I began to see a difference in my face within 6 weeks or so. My boobs are now becoming more meatier too. Length of time to take it? I would say for life, but then that would be up to the individual. I mean, it would be a shame to give up on it when it was giving such good results. Also, after the age of 25, the body makes less and less collagen by itself which is why sagging, wrinkles etc happen. If it is possible to replenish what we can't make and continue to look better/younger for longer, then it has to be worth it........right?
Hope that's answered your questions.
Love
=^_^= x
Liz
(Login Liz1967)
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 13 2007, 10:41 AM
Thanks Faery.
With the second question I wanted to know iff colagen pills can help us to lose that extra wheight that NBE brought to our body.
faerycat
(Login faerycat)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 13 2007, 10:28 PM
Some more info for you Liz -
Description
COLLAGEN - Collagen supplement. Higher Nature CollaFlex Gold, 180 tablets. For joints, skin.
Pure marine collagen for joints . As a vital part of joint cartilage, Collagen is essential for supple and flexible joints. In fact, it is responsible for the shiny surfaces that enable joints to move smoothly and and comfortably.
Researchers believe, however, that we lose approximately 1.5% of our Collagen per year after the age of 25-30. Collaflex Gold provides pure marine collagen, hydrolysed for easy absorption as a nutritional support for joints. It is best taken with a daily multivitamin/mineral and vitamin C.
Directions
Take 3-10 tablets a day with or between meals or as your health professional advises.
A daily mulivitamin/mineral and vitamin C are also recommended.
Nutritional Information
Three tablets typically provide: Collagen Hydrolysate 2100mg (non shark marine sourced) providing Proline, Hydroxyproline,hydroxylysine.
No added sugar, salt, soya, wheat, gluten, yeast, lactose, dairy products, artificial preservatives, colours or flavourings.
Ingredients
Collagen hydrosalate, Lithoamnion calcarea, microcrystalline cellulose, magnesium stearate, hydroxypropyl methylcellulose coating.
Caution
Keep out of the reach of children
Further Information
Collagen is regularly described as the building blocks of the skin. It therefore has a key role to play in creating and maintaining healthy skin all over the body.
It has, however, been scientifically shown that it diminishes at a rate of approximately 1.5% per annum from the age of 25 years onwards. Now it's possible to replenish your body's Collagen without expensive, intrusive injections.
It is, therefore, not surprising that the skins collagen is being replenished through subcutaneous injections. Procedures of this nature seem to be very much on the increase and undoubtedly bring short-term benefits.
The drawbacks are that they only target a small area, they are quite expensive and they need repeating on a regular basis.
Benefits of Collagen
Boosts the bodys collagen production. Smoothes fine lines and wrinkles.
Helps carry oxygen to the skin.
Firms and tones the skin.
Plumps up the skin.
Naturally detoxifies skin tissue. Excellent results with cellulite. Replaces lost elasticity.
What is Collagen?
Collagen is a major structural protein which provides protection and support to soft issues and connects them with the skeleton.
Collagen accounts for approximately 25% of all the protein in the body.
Collagen is the glue that holds the body together.
Collagen is the most abundant structural protein in the body, 75% of the dermis consists of collagen and it accounts for 90% of dermal volume.
Collagen holds the key to healthy skin as it provides the skins strength, resilience and firmness.
Collagen builds scar tissue to assist in healing damaged skin.
The Skin
The Skin is the bodys largest organ and constitutes approximately 15% of its total weight. It is composed of 3 layers - the epidermis, the dermis and the sub-cutaneous tissue. The Dermis, often referred to as the living skin, makes up 90% of the bulk of the skin and 75% of the dermis is collagen.
From the age of 17-25 years the skin starts to age As the skin ages, the dermis becomes thinner and we lose collagen at a rate of approximately 1.5% per annum.
Collagen targets:
Ageing skin.
Wrinkles.
Frown lines.
Crows feet.
Nasal-labial lines.
Under nourished and sun damaged skin. Dry and cracked skin.
Scarring and Wound healing.
It can be taken to enhance the results of these treatments and provide benefits for the whole body.
Collagen is a non-invasive alternative for Botox, collagen injections and similar procedures.
The effects of orally ingested collagen are cumulative.
Face Lifts
There are many face-lift programmes and treatments on the market. These mostly work on the surface of the skin and their effects are temporary.
Collagen works inside the body, all over the body, at the level of the dermis and its effects are cumulative. Collagen can therefore improve the results of face lift treatments.
Weight Management
If taken regularly, collagen can preserve and build and replenish lean muscle mass and encourage the body to shed fat. Collagen may therefore help with inch loss and cellulite.
Pregnant or nursing mothers, and children under 12 should always consult their licensed health professional before taking any supplements.
http://www.elixirhealth.co.uk/asps/ShowDetails.asp?id=1017
So yes, it does appear so help with cellulite and weight loss after all. No wonders mines has disappeared. Lol, and there was me thinking that all my hard efforts down the gym were paying off.
x
faerycat
(Login faerycat)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 13 2007, 10:30 PM
I see they recommed these be taken between meals, but from all the other research I have done.......as well as personal experience, they are really better taken on an empty stomach just before bed time.
x
faerycat
(Login faerycat)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 13 2007, 10:41 PM
Some more info -
Pure Marine Collagen
Natural nutritional protein supplement for optimum health!
- collagen for the creation of skin, muscle, bone and cartilage.
Collagen is the main natural protein that makes up our ligaments, joints, hair, skin and nails, and provides our bodies with structural support. Twenty-five per cent of the dry protein weight of the human body is collagen - the fibrous, elastic, connective tissue in our bodies that holds us together. Seventy-five per cent of our skin is made up of collagen, providing texture, resiliency, and shape; and in total about 30 per cent of our body is collagen. Collagen is the protein that literally holds our skin up.
THE FACE LIFT IN A CAPSULE!
As we age, our body's production of collagen slows down. On the outside we see our skin start to wrinkle and lose its youthful radiance. On the inside we experience this as the weakening of our skeletal structure due to the breakdown of connective tissue, including muscle tissue.
Unfortunately, collagen production reduces by 1.5 per cent per year after the age of 25. So by the time you are 50, your body produces one third less collagen that it did when you left school.
Collagen supplementation is essential to support the body during these natural ageing processes.
Benefits of taking 100% marine collagen:
Boosts collagen production naturally (especially beneficial for stickler syndrome sufferers)
Strengthens nail and hair follicles
Smoothes fine lines and wrinkles & increases the elasticity of the skin
Regenerates lean muscle mass and improves circulation
- due to muscle tissue leaning
Firms and tones
Lose inches where needed and reduce fat mass
Regenerates joints and cartilage
Reduces arthritic pain
Feeds the connective tissues
Improves endurance and vitality
Helps to carry oxygen through the body
Naturally detoxifies
Benefit from a better sleep
Take 100% marine collagen to rejuvenate!
How does 100% marine collagen work?
100% Marine Collagen works from the inside and contains the antioxidant Vitamin C which is an essential co factor in enhancing the action of 100% Marine Collagen. The role of collagen is to nourish the skin from the inside and maintain the highest levels of skin texture through the continuous renewal of its cells, preventing dehydration and minimizing the appearance of wrinkles and stretch marks.
In the first 45 to 90 minutes of sleep your body goes into a repair and rebuild or "rejuvenation" mode. As we grow older, this process slows down. 100% marine collagen is formulated in such a way that it can assist the repair and rebuilding process.
Each capsule = 700mg
30 Capsules = 15 days' supply
60 Capsules = 1 month's supply
180 Capsules = 3 months' supply
Some people experience an improvement after just a few weeks whilst others will need a number of months to see and feel a significant difference. For this reason an initial 3~6 month course is recommended. Increasingly we find that people wish to continue with the collagen after only a few weeks.
http://www.bodyandmindshop.com/product/052.html
x
faerycat
(Login faerycat)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 13 2007, 10:43 PM
Also -
http://www.simply-beautiful.co.uk/simply_collagen_information.htm#collagen2
Scroll all the way down the page.
sophie9
(Login sophie9)
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 14 2007, 3:57 AM
faerycat,
i ordered the three month supply you suggested off of ebay. how much do you take a day? i looked at your program page, and i thought you said you take two. did you start taking that much right away, or did you start off with one pill and decide to boost it to reap more benefits. i ask because it is slightly pricey and has to be ordered from overseas - but if it works, i think it is worth totally worth it. And do you really notice a difference in your lips? that would be great if that happens for me! i have a lip plumper that uses marine collagen.
faerycat
(Login faerycat)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 14 2007, 9:55 AM
Hi Sophie,
Yes, I take 2 x 1000mg caps before bed. Collagen isn't really something you can start off low then ramp up. You would really be wasting your time and money by doing that. You need to get as much of that stuff in as possible.
Some companies recommend that you take an extra capsule (daytime) for the first 3 months or so to get quicker results, then continue with the 2 capsules. It is up to yourself really, but they are expensive. If you can afford it, do it.
Yes too.......big difference in my lips. Lol, they were beginning to fray and shrivel a bit before I started collagen and now they are moist, pouty and meaty again :-D
Don't expect overnight results. It will take time but is worth it.
x
Liz
(Login Liz1967)
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 14 2007, 10:22 AM
Faery were shall I buy colagen in Europe, wich site do you recomend - the better product less expensive.
Anonymous
(Login gingerD)
SENIOR MEMBER
My collagen exp
March 14 2007, 1:12 PM
loads of info there feary nice one!!-glad things r going well-
Have u ordered any of that soap?-i have and cant wait to soap mi sen up-lol
My collagen says take 6 1000mg tabs per day
I take 3, because i simply can not afford to take 6 a day or the tub will get used up quicker.
I take all my meds in 1 go in the morning on an empty stomach
Im 23 i know generally collagen is recco for people 25+ so i don't think i require loads of collagen but i deffinatly think it has helped in my NBE.and i agree i think you sort of have to take it 4eva but i will if i look youthfull 4 eva 2
My skin has greatly improved it took about 6 weeks as feary said,My hair is growing like wild fire at pres the worst roots eva! but i great condition and nails are growing 2,and i also think its helped with plumpage in the breasts however mine could be through collagen massage.
i take collagen +c i got it from ebay-mine is BO though as apposed to marine and it has added vitimin c
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/100-NATURAL-SUPER-COLLAGEN-C-Amazing-250-Tablets_W0QQitemZ130086743910QQcategoryZ33164QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Liz
(Login Liz1967)
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 14 2007, 1:43 PM
Is ti safe to buy pills on e-bay, i means how can I know if it is the real think and not a fraude?
Anonymous
(Login gingerD)
SENIOR MEMBER
Re: To Faerycat - about colagen
March 14 2007, 2:08 PM
well yeh, i mean they come sealed with cotton wool inside the bottles as well,
i understand your causiousness,i dont buy unnamed products,i reaserch the products i see, check they are the same etc and tend to buy from powersellers with alot of good feedback and that sell the same sort of products-i jst find alot of things are cheaper and its easyier, i worry about using my credit card details on other sites,i supose i trust ebay more than other sites.