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Herbal breast enhancement

#1

prettypurplekao 4 inch growth with Fenugreek, and bustea


Very, very hard to believe. The science absolutely says no way!


Weak plant estrogens equals zippo!
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#2

Not true. There are plenty of women who have grown on what you call weak plant estrogens, including myself and a good friend of mine, not to mention an enormous number of women in this forum including Eve herself.
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#3

I'm 100% in agreement with solitaire. If absolutely no one grew on the common herbs, then nobody would recommend them and neither would there be noticeable results in the photo section on the old forum! Not sayin' they work for everybody--they weren't as effective in my case, admittedly--but they def don't have a zero success rate. Rolleyes
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#4

I have received calls over 10 years from companies going out of business with these types of formulas in the US. They all agree they don't work. Please read a review of the science. I personally do not believe they work. Weight gain increases breast size.





CURRENT COMMENTARY
“Bust Enhancing” Herbal
Products
Adriane Fugh-Berman, MD
Department of Health Care Sciences, George Washington University School of
Medicine, Washington, DC
“Bust enhancing” herbal products are widely advertised.
No clinical trials have been published. These products
contain a variety of ingredients, including grains, hops, saw
palmetto, dong quai, chaste-tree berry, wild yam, kava,
fennel, black cohosh, and fenugreek. Several of these herbs
are hormonally active; for example, hops contain 8-prenylnaringenin,
a phytoestrogen that is more potent than other
dietary phytoestrogens. Many bust-enhancing dietary supplements
contain substrates for Fusarium, a fungus that
produces zearalenone, a potent estrogen that has been
associated with breast enlargement in humans and other
species. The use of bust-enhancing products should be
discouraged because of lack of evidence for efficacy and
long-term safety concerns. (Obstet Gynecol 2003;101:
1345–9. © 2003 by The American College of Obstetricians
and Gynecologists.)
“Bust enhancing” dietary supplements are widely marketed
to young women. A typical product costs $229 for
an 8-week supply. These products contain variable combinations
of herbs, the most popular being hops (Humulus
lupulus), saw palmetto (Serenoa repens), damiana (Turnera
diffusa), dong quai (Angelica sinensis), chaste-tree berry
(Vitex agnus-castus), blessed thistle (Cnicus benedictus), dandelion
(Taraxacum officinale), wild yam (Dioscorea villosa),
kava (Piper methysticum), fennel (Foeniculum vulgare), black
cohosh (Cimicifuga racemosa), and fenugreek (Trigonella
foenum-graecum). Some products also contain cereal
grains, including barley and oats. Here I review available
evidence on the efficacy and safety of purported bustenhancing
products. The databases MEDLINE (1966–
2002), TOXLINE (1972–2002), and REPROTOX
were searched broadly using the following key words:
“bust enhancers,” “breast enlargement,” “mammoplasia,”
“gynecomastia,” “Fusarium,” “zearalenone,”
“zearalenol,” “8-prenylnaringenin,” and the names of the
individual herbs and grains listed above. Information
from this search was supplemented from the author’s
extensive files.
HUMAN AND ANIMAL STUDIES
No clinical trials on the efficacy of bust-enhancing dietary
supplements have been published or presented to
the scientific community. The popularity of these products
stems from promotion on television, on the Internet,
and in magazines aimed at young women. Testimonials
are heavily used. An episode of the television show
20/20 on bust-enhancing products (aired June 21, 2002)
revealed that filmed testimonials were from paid actors,
and suggested that differences shown in “before and
after” pictures could be accounted for by lower-cut clothing
and pushup bras.
No animal studies have examined the effect of bustenhancing
products or their constituents on mammary
glands. Two estrogenicity assays of these products in
rodents were identified.1,2 One showed no estrogenic
effect on the uterus, whereas the other showed only
small and inconsistent effects. The first study tested
Erdic (Erdic International, London, United Kingdom)
(also sold as “Busting Out”), a product based on grains
and hops.1 The composition of this product has changed
over time. The current ingredients are “hops, buckwheat,
fennel, rye, malt, barley, and L-ornitine [sic]”3; the
package of a product purchased in 1999 states that it
contains “barley, hops (2 sorts), rye, wheat, malt, black
oats, maize.” It is not clear which formulation was tested.
Twenty female Sprague–Dawley rats from four dams
(litters were reduced to ten pups per dam) were randomly
distributed to three groups of six weanlings each.
Controls consumed a soy-free diet (AIN-93), positive
controls consumed the same diet with 160g of estradiol
3-benzoate, and the third group received a 20% powdered
Erdic, 80% AIN-93 diet for 3 days. There were no
differences in uterine weights among the Erdic and control
groups. Mean body weights were similar among
groups.
The second study, in mice, tested an herbal “bust
enhancement” product (not otherwise identified) containing
significant amounts of hops phytoestrogens.2
Fourteen day 18 mice were injected subcutaneously with
0.1 mL of an extract of the supplement or 17-ethinyl
estradiol dissolved in corn oil. Animals were killed on
day 4. Ovariectomized adult mice (seven per group)
received feed containing either 17-ethinyl estradiol or
Address reprint requests to: Adriane Fugh-Berman, MD, 1312
18th Street NW, Washington DC 20036; E-mail: fughberman@
aol.com.
The author acknowledges Ed Kennelly, PhD, and Fredi Kronenberg, PhD, for
high-pressure liquid chromatography analysis.
VOL. 101, NO. 6, JUNE 2003 0029-7844/03/$30.00 1345
© 2003 by The American College of Obstetricians and Gynecologists. Published by Elsevier. doi:10.1016/S0029-7844(03)00362-4
the herbal supplement in feed (1:1, 1:9, and 1:99 weight/
weight) for 5 days and were killed on day 6. In the
prepubertal mouse uterotrophic bioassay, the dietary
supplement significantly increased the uterus/body
weight fraction at two of five doses in a non–dose
dependent manner (0.24 and 0.84 g of 8-prenylnaringenin,
but not 0.024, 0.084, or 2.4 g of 8-prenylnaringenin).
In the ovariectomized mouse uterotrophic bioassay,
the dietary supplement significantly reduced the
uterine/body weight fraction in only the lowest of three
doses (at a ratio of 1:99, but not 1:9 or 1:1). Oral dosing
significantly decreased uterine weight in mice only at the
lowest dose tested (13.6 ng of 8-prenylnaringenin/g) and
not in a dose-dependent manner. 17-ethinyl estradiol
significantly increased the uterine/body weight fraction
relative to controls in both bioassays. The researchers
concluded that the supplement has only weak effects on
the uterus even with oral doses containing 542 ng/g of
8-prenylnaringenin, representing a dose 258-fold higher
than expected daily intake of the product.
ESTROGENICITY STUDIES IN INDIVIDUAL HERBS
Hops (Humulus lupulus)
Several herbs used in these formulas have been tested for
estrogenic effects. A common ingredient in bust-enhancing
formulas, hops (Humulus lupulus L.) contain the phytoestrogen
8-prenylnaringenin. Beer is flavored with
hops and may contain 8-prenylnaringenin, but beer has
not been specifically linked to breast enlargement.4 Anecdotally,
female hops pickers have developed menstrual
irregularities5 (8-prenylnaringenin apparently can be absorbed
via the skin). The scientist who isolated 8-prenylnaringenin
from hops credits his interest in the field to
his wife’s development of menstrual irregularities after
working with hops.6
A small, methodologically flawed study found a benefit
of 30 days of treatment with large doses of hops
extract (1600–2600 mg per day, titrating down to 1200–
1600 mg) on hot flashes in 25 women.7 The study was
not randomized, and the control group was apparently
composed of five women who had been accidentally
treated with a low dose of hops (300 mg), which because
it showed no benefit was considered a placebo. In 17 of
20 treated subjects, reduction of hot flash score (intensity
 frequency) was significantly better than in controls;
neither statistical test nor significance level was stated.
Some subjects apparently received another herb, hawthorn
(Crataegus sp), as well as hops.
8-prenylnaringenin has 0.2–20% of the potency of
estradiol.3 Other hops phytoestrogens, including 6-prenylnaringenin,
6,8-diprenylnaringen, and 8-geranylnaringenin,
are also estrogenic, but have only 1% of the
potency of 8-prenylnaringenin.8 8-prenylnaringenin
binds equally to  and  estrogen receptors.9 A study of
8-prenylnaringenin, administered subcutaneously,
found that 30 g/g per day caused uterotrophic effects in
ovariectomized rats.9 8-prenylnaringenin was more potent
than coumestrol, genistein, or daidzein in several
assays, including stimulation of alkaline phosphatase in
Ishikawa Var I cells and competitive displacement from
rat uterine cytosol by [2,4,6,7-3H]17-estradiol).10 In
ovariectomized mice, 100 g of 8-prenylnaringenin/mL
(about 15 mg/kg per day) caused an estrogenic mitotic
response in vaginal but not endometrial epithelium.4
Black Cohosh (Cimicifuga racemosa)
It is unclear whether or not black cohosh, currently a
popular treatment for hot flashes, has an estrogenic
effect. Clinical studies are mixed, but some show a
benefit of black cohosh for treating hot flashes or improving
the vaginal maturation index; it does not appear to
affect prolactin, estradiol, sex hormone–binding globulin,
luteinizing hormone (LH), or follicle-stimulating hormone
(FSH) levels in humans.11 Even if black cohosh is
effective for treating hot flashes, this is not necessarily an
estrogenic effect.
Formerly thought to contain the phytoestrogen formononetin,
black cohosh has not been found to contain
formononetin in recent studies.12 It does contain small
amounts of a recently identified phytoestrogen, fukinolic
acid13 (2E-caffeoylfukiic acid), which has shown estrogenic
activity in a breast cancer cell line and increased
uterine weight in rats.13 It is difficult to extrapolate from
the activity of an isolated constituent to use of the whole
herb, especially when the constituent is present in tiny
quantities. In vivo and in vitro estrogenicity studies of
black cohosh are mixed. Increased uterine weight was
seen in two studies of mice given black cohosh14 (Eagon
CL, Elm MS, Teepe AG, Eagon PK. Medicinal botanicals.
Estrogenicity in rat uterus and liver [abstract]. Proc
Am Assoc Cancer Res 1997;38:293); two other studies
showed no estrogenic effects in mice given oral doses15,16
or rats given injected doses.16 A recent test of black
cohosh in several in vitro assays for estrogenicity
showed no estrogenic activity.17
Dong Quai (Angelica sinensis)
Dong quai, a Chinese herb used in many women’s
health formulas, has been tested for hot flashes in a
randomized, double-blind clinical trial; there was no
effect on hot flashes, vaginal mucosa, or endometrium.18
The herb is not considered estrogenic in traditional
Chinese medicine. There is one report of dong quai–
associated gynecomastia (breast enlargement in males)
in a man in Singapore.19 This appears to be an isolated
1346 Fugh-Berman “Bust Enhancing” Herbal Products OBSTETRICS & GYNECOLOGY
case, and the product was not analyzed; it may have been
adulterated with drugs.
Fennel (Foeniculum vulgare)
Little information is available on fennel seed, used as
both a culinary and a medicinal herb, but one animal
study found an estrogenic effect. In female rats, oral
administration of an acetone extract of fennel seed (dose
not available in abstract) for 10 days caused vaginal
cornification and estrus.20 Moderate doses increased the
weight of mammary glands; higher doses increased the
weight of the oviduct, endometrium, myometrium, cervix,
and vagina.
OTHER HORMONAL EFFECTS
Kava (Piper methysticum)
Kava appears to have dopamine antagonist effects.21
Dopamine antagonists increase prolactin secretion, and
increased prolactin may be associated with mammoplasia
(breast enlargement in women). Selective serotonin
reuptake inhibitors can increase prolactin levels, and an
observational study in 59 women treated with selective
serotonin reuptake inhibitors or venlafaxine for more
than 2 months found that 23 of them (39%) reported
some mammoplasia.22
Saw Palmetto (Serenoa repens)
Saw palmetto, used primarily to treat benign prostatic
hypertrophy, inhibits binding of dihydrotestosterone to
androgen receptors in prostate cells and inhibits binding
of [3H]dihydrotestosterone to its receptor in human
foreskin fibroblasts.23 Saw palmetto also inhibits prolactin24
and has potent 1-adrenoceptor effects in vitro.25
Studies are mixed on whether or not saw palmetto
inhibits 5-reductase.26–28 An antiestrogenic effect was
noted in men with benign prostatic hyperplasia who
received Serenoa repens (160 mg twice a day).29 These
effects would not be expected to enlarge breasts.
Chaste-Tree Berry (Vitex agnus-castus)
Vitex decreases FSH and increases LH, and inhibits
prolactin activity in vitro.30 None of these effects should
be associated with mammoplasia.
Fenugreek (Trigonella foenum-graecum) and Wild
Yam (Dioscorea villosa)
Although roasted fenugreek seeds were reputedly used
by harem women to enhance buxomness,31 there is no
evidence that fenugreek increases breast size. Both
fenugreek and wild yam contain diosgenin, which can be
converted to progesterone in a laboratory, but there is no
evidence that such conversion takes place endogenously.
An article distributed as evidence that diosgenin increases
mammary size does not support the claim. This
experiment, in which 20- or 40-mg/kg diosgenin was
given with or without estrogen to ovariectomized mice,
found no difference in wet or fat-free dry weight of
mammary glands in diosgenin-treated mice.32 Diosgenin
did significantly affect mammary maturation, increasing
terminal end bud differentiation (an effect that takes
place in late pregnancy or under estrogen treatment).
Although the words “growth stimulator” and “mammary
development” are used, in this case maturation is what
is meant.
ADVERSE EFFECTS OF BUST-ENHANCING HERBS
No adverse effects of the most common bust-enhancing
herbal products were apparent on the US Food and
Drug Administration Special Nutritionals Adverse
Event Reporting System (accessed August 2002). Kava
has been associated with numerous cases of hepatotoxicity
and should not be used33; acute dystonic reactions
have been reported as well. Dong quai has been associated
with increased risk of bleeding when combined with
anticoagulants.34 No serious adverse events have been
associated with black cohosh, saw palmetto, fennel,
damiana, blessed thistle (Cnicus benedictus), or dandelion
(Taraxacum officinale).
Most of the ingredients in these products have not
been associated with significant adverse effects. Estrogenic
stimulation of breast or endometrial tissue is of
concern with long-term ingestion of hormonally active
compounds; however, data to date do not support potent
hormonal effects of the labeled ingredients in bust-enhancing
products.
COULD THESE PRODUCTS BE EFFECTIVE?
No clinical trial of a bust-enhancing herbal product has
been published. It is unlikely that any of these products,
if they contain what their labels say that they contain,
would cause breast enlargement. Drugs associated with
gynecomastia or mammoplasia include estrogen, protease
inhibitors, penicillamine, neuroleptics, and antidepressants
(including tricyclics, monoamine oxidase inhibitors,
and serotonin reuptake inhibitors).35 No cases
of gynecomastia or mammoplasia have been reported
for herbs or grains except for a single unreliable case of
gynecomastia associated with dong quai (the product
was not analyzed to exclude steroid adulteration, which
is not uncommon in Asian herbal medicine products).
Some herbs contain estrogenic compounds, but the phenolic
phytoestrogens found in plants would not be expected
to be potent enough to cause mammoplasia. Kava
VOL. 101, NO. 6, JUNE 2003 Fugh-Berman “Bust Enhancing” Herbal Products 1347
has dopamine antagonist qualities and could raise prolactin
levels, but this effect has not been demonstrated
and would be unlikely to be strong.
The labeled ingredients in bust-enhancing products
are unlikely to enlarge breasts. However, some bustenhancing
products contain hops or grains that are excellent
substrates for Fusarium, a mold that commonly
infests cereal grains. Fusarium spp produce zearalenone,
an anabolic, potent resorcyclic acid lactone phytoestrogen.
Fusarium has been identified in corn, wheat, barley,
malt, rye, oats, and beer (which contains hops).36 Sprouting,
or “malting” barley (an excellent substrate for Fusarium)
increases the zearalenone concentration 50-fold.37
Zearalenone from moldy feed affects the reproductive
organs of animals. Male and female pigs given moldy
feed contaminated with Fusarium suffer mammary enlargement
and other symptoms.37 Humans may also be
affected. Fusarium-contaminated grain was linked to “endemic
breast enlargement disease” in China.38 It was
later determined that all samples of buckwheat grown in
the area were infected with mold; 34% were infected
with Fusarium.39 Zearalenone was extracted from the
affected buckwheat.
There is no evidence that bust-enhancing products are
contaminated with Fusarium. However, to my knowledge
only one product has been tested. A high-pressure liquid
chromatography analysis of an Erdic product purchased
in 1999 revealed no zearalenone or -zearalenol (unpublished
data, E. Kennelly, F. Kronenberg, A. Fugh-Berman).
It would be enlightening to analyze the plethora of
available products for the presence of zearalenone or
zearalenol.
CONCLUSION
There is no published evidence for efficacy of bustenhancing
herbal supplements. Products marketed for
“bust enhancement” contain herbs that may have pharmacological
effects. There are no long-term safety data
on any of these herbs, singly or in combination. Some
products contain substrates for Fusarium, a zearalenoneproducing
fungus associated with breast enlargement in
humans and pigs. Physicians should discourage the ingestion
of pharmacologically active substances with unknown
safety risks for the purpose of breast enlargement.
REFERENCES
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Wolfe BE, Brashear WT, et al. Bioavailability of pure
isoflavones in healthy humans and analysis of commercial
soy isoflavone supplements. J Nutr 2001;131(Suppl):
1362S–75S.
2. Coldham NG, Sauer MJ. Identification, quantitation and
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Accessed 2002 Aug 10.
4. Milligan S, Kalita J, Pocock V, Heyerick A, De Cooman L,
Rong H, et al. Oestrogenic activity of the hop phytooestrogen,
8-prenylnaringenin. Reproduction 2002;123:
235–42.
5. Verzele M. 100 years of hop chemistry and its relevance to
brewing. J Inst Brewing 1986;92:32–48.
6. Milligan SR. Hops and women’s health. Altern Ther
Womens Health 2002;4(6):44–7.
7. Goetz P. Traitement des bouffe´es de chaleur par insuffisance
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Rev Phytother Pratique 1990;4:13–5.
8. Milligan SR, Kalita JC, Pocock V, Van De Kauter V,
Stevens JF, Deinzer ML, et al. The endocrine activities of
8-prenylnaringenin and related hop (Humulus lupulus L.)
flavonoids. J Clin Endocrinol Metab 2000;85:4912–5.
9. Miyamoto M, Matsushita Y, Kiyokawa A, Fukuda C,
Iijima Y, Sugano M, et al. Prenylflavonoids: A new class of
non-steroidal phytoestrogen (part 2). Estrogenic effects of
8-isopentenylnaringenin on bone metabolism. Planta Med
1998;64:516–9.
10. Milligan SR, Kalita JC, Heyerick A, Rong H, De Cooman
L, De Keukeleire D. Identification of a potent phytoestrogen
in hops (Humulus lupulus L.) and beer. J Clin Endocrinol
Metab 1999;83:2249–52.
11. Kronenberg F, Fugh-Berman A. Complementary and
alternative medicine for menopausal symptoms: A review
of randomized, controlled trials. Ann Intern Med 2002;
147:805–13.
12. Kennelly EJ, Baggett S, Nuntanakorn P, Ososki AL, Mori
SA, Duke J, et al. Analysis of thirteen populations of black
cohosh for formononetin. Phytomedicine 2002;9:461–7.
13. Kruse SO, Lohning A, Pauli GF, Winterhoff H, Nahrstedt
A. Fukiic and piscidic acid esters from the rhizome of
Cimicifuga racemosa and the in vitro estrogenic activity of
fukinolic acid. Planta Med 1999;65:763–4.
14. Liu Z, Yang Z, Zhu M, Huo J. Estrogenicity of black
cohosh (Cimicifuga racemosa) and its effect on estrogen
receptor level in human breast cancer MCF-7 cells [in
Chinese]. Wei Sheng Yan Jiu 2001;30(2):77–80.
15. Amato P, Christophe S, Mellon PL. Estrogenic activity of
herbs commonly used as remedies for menopausal symptoms.
Menopause 2002;9:145–50.
16. Einer-Jensen N, Zhao J, Anderson KP, Kristoffersen K.
Cimicifuga and Melbrosia lack oestrogenic effects in mice
and rats. Maturitas 1996;25:149–53.
17. Liu J, Burdette JE, Xu H, Gu C, van Breemen RB, Bhat
KP, et al. Evaluation of estrogenic activity of plant extracts
for the potential treatment of menopausal symptoms. J
Agric Food Chem 2001;49:2472–9.
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18. Hirata JD, Swiersz L, Zell B, Small R, Ettinger B. Does
dong quai have estrogenic effects in postmenopausal
women? A double-blind, placebo controlled trial. Fertil
Steril 1997;68:981–6.
19. Goh SY, Loh KC. Gynaecomastia and the herbal tonic
“dong quai.” Singapore Med J 2001;42(3):115–6.
20. Malini T, Vanithakumari G, Megala N, Anusya S, Devi K,
Elango V. Effect of Foeniculum vulgare Mill. seed extract
on the genital organs of male and female rats. Indian
J Physiol Pharmacol 1985;29:21–6.
21. Schelosky L, Raffauf C, Jendroska K, Poewe W. Kava and
dopamine antagonism. J Neurol Neurosurg Psychiatry
1995;58:639–40.
22. Amsterdam JD, Garcia-Espan˜ a F, Goodman D, Hooper
M, Hornig-Rohan M. Breast enlargement during chronic
antidepressant therapy. J Affect Disord 1997;46:151–6.
23. Plosker GL, Brogden RN. Serenoa repens (Permixon): A
review of its pharmacology and therapeutic efficacy in
benign prostatic hyperplasia. Drugs Aging 1996;9:379–95.
24. Vacher P, Prevarskaya N, Skryma R, Audy MC, Vacher
AM, Odessa MF, et al. The lipidosterolic extract from
Serenoa repens interferes with prolactin receptor signal
transduction. J Biomed Sci 1995;2:357–65.
25. Goepel M, Hecker U, Krege S, Rubben H, Michel MC.
Saw palmetto extracts potently and noncompetitively
inhibit human alpha-1 adrenoreceptors in vitro. Prostate
1999;38:208–15.
26. Rhodes L, Primka RL, Berman C. Comparison of finasteride
(Proscar), a 5 reductase inhibitor, and various
commercial plant extracts in in vitro and in vivo 5
reductase inhibition. Prostate 1993;22:43–51.
27. Sultan C, Terraza A, Devillier C, Carilla E, Briley M,
Loire C, et al. Inhibition of androgen metabolism and
binding by a liposterolic extract of “Serenoa repens B” in
human foreskin fibroblasts. J Steroid Biochem 1984;20:
515–9.
28. Strauch G, Perles P, Vergult G. Comparison of finasteride
(Proscar) and Serenoa repens (Permixon) in the inhibition of
5-alpha reductase in healthy male volunteers. Eur Urol
1994;26:247–52.
29. Plosker GL, Brogden RN. Serenoa repens (Permixon): A
review of its pharmacology and therapeutic efficacy in
benign prostatic hyperplasia. Drugs Aging 1996;9:379–95.
30. Fugh-Berman A. 5-minute herb and dietary supplement
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Wilkins, 2003.
31. Duke JA. Handbook of medicinal herbs. Boca Raton,
Florida: CRC Press, 2001:490.
32. Aradhana, Rao AR, Kale RK. Diosgenin—a growth stimulator
of mammary gland of ovariectomized mouse.
Indian J Exp Biol 1992;30:367–70.
33. U. S. Food and Drug Administration, Center for Food
Safety and Applied Nutrition, Office of Nutritional Products,
Labeling, and Dietary Supplements. Kava-containing
dietary supplements (Piper methysticum). Rockville,
Maryland: U.S. Food and Drug Administration. Available
at http://www.fda.gov/medwatch/SAFETY/2002/safety02.
htm#kava. Accessed 2003 Mar 19.
34. Fugh-Berman A. Herb-drug interactions. Lancet 2000;
355:134–8.
35. Lemack GE, Poppas DP, Vaughan ED. Urologic causes of
gynecomastia: Approach to diagnosis and management.
Urology 1995;45:313–9.
36. IARC. Toxins derived from Fusarium graminearum, F. culmorum,
F. crookwellense: Zearalenone, deoxynivalenol,
nivalenol and fusarenone X. IARC Monogr Eval Carcinog
Risks Hum 1993;56:397–444.
37. Schoental R. Tricothecenes, zearalenone, and other carcinogenic
metabolites of Fusarium and related microfungi.
Adv Cancer Res 1985;45:217–88.
38. Yonghang Z, Shaobing Z, Weijun T, et al. Isolation of
Fusarium and extraction of its toxin from buckwheat
grown in an area with “endemic breast enlargement” disease
[in Chinese]. Chung Hua Yu Fang Hsueh Tsa Chih
1995;29:273–5.
39. Zhang Y, Zhu S, Tong W. Isolation of fusarium and
extraction of its toxin from buckwheat grown in an area
with “endemic breast enlargement” disease [in Chinese].
Zhonghua Yu Fang Yi Xue Za Zhi 1995;29:273–5.
Received November 26, 2002. Received in revised form December 16,
2002. Accepted January 23, 2003.
VOL. 101, NO. 6, JUNE 2003 Fugh-Berman “Bust Enhancing” Herbal Products 1349
Reply
#5

I think you're missing the point and don't seem to understand that posting sceptical reports won't achieve anything, because we already know that science is sceptical. The fact is that many women say they have succeeeded with these herbs, whatever mainstream science says about it not being proven, and these women will tell you quite plainly that they did not succeed by gaining weight. I'll say it again that we already know science is sceptical, that isn't something that counts as news.
Reply
#6

I have soo had it with people coming here telling us we are basically too simple to breathe. why do they come on and post if they have never tried NBE? Lots have women have achieved major grow doing NBE so take your science and lodge it somewhere uncomfortable.
This forum has really taken a negative hit lately,,, too bad.
I went from a A to a B cup on Bellas,,, so all the nay sayers take your negative comments and choke on them.
The long winded poster above is EXACTLY why I hardly come here anymore and I have been here since 2005. It sucks the way this forum has turned out.[/size]
Reply
#7

I never said Pueraria Mirifica does not work. I know that it does work and the animal studies support this. When you add miroestrol to a young animal that has had the uterous removed the animal grows breasts...remember this is now an animal that can not produce estrogen.


None of the weak phytoestrogens has demonstrated this. There is a study done (fenugreek) with mice where the uterous is removed...fenugreek added and guess what no breasts. You can find this citation on many websites. It was on Bella's she took off references to Fenugreek.

You can't hype out the animals. I welcome a study....animal or human.

Another point a ton of companies have come and gone in the US.....the complaint is the stuff does not work.

Because of many of these weak formulations with fenugreek, saw palmetto etc the big mfg in the US have recoiled from many products out of Pueraria Mirifica. They just don't believe it.

Of course with PM they are wrong. The british did a study in the early 1960's that demonstrated this. You can't hype out the animals with marketing.
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#8

So how do you explain someone like Lucille then? She took pictures of her progress week by week and you could see how she'd grown a cup size. And from the pictures she had no sign of any weight gain either.
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#9

Wait, so because one study using a single herb of unknown amounts failed, it means *nothing* can work? Seriously? Not to mention that you keep lumping kitchen sink products together with individual programs based on varying amounts of multiple herbs (far above what those shoddy products provide).

Science begins like so many things, trial and error. Just because one application of something fails doesn't mean that all others will. If that were the case, we'd have no dosing needs based on age, weight, severity, etc. We'd all take the same amounts of all medications and be effected precisely the same. That is quite obviously not the case with meds, so why should it be any different with herbs? Or how about the fact that some people don't even react to 100% proven effective treatments? Does that mean that all the people they do work for are just imagining it? Falling for the "hype"? I think not.

The biggest failing in this area where science is concerned is that herbs cannot be trademarked and therefore the money just isn't there for the extensive research that really needs to be done to prove or disprove them once and for all. I doubt that will ever happen. However, for those who decide to give it a shot and have success (as MANY here have) they don't need anyone telling them it works. They aren't sheep that will only believe what someone else tells them. They are the pioneers that will hopefully stand out of the crowd and eventually give hope to others who wish to take a chance themselves.

One final note / question: this thread was posted for the sole purpose of asking about a specific product that is PM based, regardless of what else it contains. You obviously have zero personal experience with it yet you felt the need to come and bash herbs in general, then backpedal and say that PM does work, but THIS product simply can't... why? What do you gain from such rudeness?
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#10

Hi Girls

For me information is power. It seems when someone provides you with information that is contrary to your beliefs you loose it. This stuff is not a religion. You should be looking for as much information as possible to be successful. If all you want to know is janie or sandy or someone else's experience on the internet, that is quite limiting.

IF you met some of these people in person would you still confide in them...maybe and maybe not. The lady doctor took alot of time to research and write her article. You don't appreciate her efforts but you do value someone's report that you never met on the internet.

Its not negative its not positive, it simply asseses that information about phytoestrogens.
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