[Sammy95]

Thanks kaitlyn9 its good to get someone elses advice and opinion especially when they have a better understanding of how the herbs affect your hormones.

I have been reading the thread about chiyomilk which ia rather fascinating. If true she had amazing success. A couple of things i wondered though and i am not sure if you can answer this but i wondered why during her luteal phase she took a product still containing phyestrogens but weaker versions ie.fenugreek, saw palmetto and red clover, as i understand the luteal phase is when you should take herbs to influence progesterone? She also takes pig placenta + HA during luteal phase....do you know why?

I have been reading endless info on here, i feel like i have been glued to it for the last week, im finding it all both fascinating but also rather mind boggling at times trying to retain all the information.

I am still trying to figure out what i should be taking during the luteal phase, any ideas would be great. In the mean time its read read read.

Thanks again.

[Kaitlyn Kitten]

Thanks kaitlyn9 its good to get someone elses advice and opinion especially when they have a better understanding of how the herbs affect your hormones.

I have been reading the thread about chiyomilk which ia rather fascinating. If true she had amazing success. A couple of things i wondered though and i am not sure if you can answer this but i wondered why during her luteal phase she took a product still containing phyestrogens but weaker versions ie.fenugreek, saw palmetto and red clover, as i understand the luteal phase is when you should take herbs to influence progesterone? She also takes pig placenta + HA during luteal phase....do you know why?

I have been reading endless info on here, i feel like i have been glued to it for the last week, im finding it all both fascinating but also rather mind boggling at times trying to retain all the information.

I am still trying to figure out what i should be taking during the luteal phase, any ideas would be great. In the mean time its read read read.

Thanks again.

Hey, glad I can help!

The reason for taking a weaker estrogenic herb during luteal is to still maintain proper levels. Estrogen is still present during luteal but is much lower than progesterone. So if you were to significantly raise your progesterone yet do nothing to raise your estrogen, you'd have a hormone imbalance. For instance, when I took Ainterol PM during follicular, I would get these persistent dull headaches. I was getting too much estrogen, so id use a little PC cream to help re-balance.

Pig placenta is very close to a humans and it contains a lot of human growth hormones that is helpful for NBE. I'm going to start use sheep placenta to obtain higher levels of HGH.

Something to use during luteal is defiantly PC! Its helped me greatly!

And keep reading! I know its a lot to try to wrap your brain around, but eventually it becomes very easy to understand once you familiarize yourself with everything.

[Sammy95]

Thanks kaitlyn9 its good to get someone elses advice and opinion especially when they have a better understanding of how the herbs affect your hormones.

I have been reading the thread about chiyomilk which ia rather fascinating. If true she had amazing success. A couple of things i wondered though and i am not sure if you can answer this but i wondered why during her luteal phase she took a product still containing phyestrogens but weaker versions ie.fenugreek, saw palmetto and red clover, as i understand the luteal phase is when you should take herbs to influence progesterone? She also takes pig placenta + HA during luteal phase....do you know why?

I have been reading endless info on here, i feel like i have been glued to it for the last week, im finding it all both fascinating but also rather mind boggling at times trying to retain all the information.

I am still trying to figure out what i should be taking during the luteal phase, any ideas would be great. In the mean time its read read read.

Thanks again.

Hey, glad I can help!

The reason for taking a weaker estrogenic herb during luteal is to still maintain proper levels. Estrogen is still present during luteal but is much lower than progesterone. So if you were to significantly raise your progesterone yet do nothing to raise your estrogen, you'd have a hormone imbalance. For instance, when I took Ainterol PM during follicular, I would get these persistent dull headaches. I was getting too much estrogen, so id use a little PC cream to help re-balance.

Pig placenta is very close to a humans and it contains a lot of human growth hormones that is helpful for NBE. I'm going to start use sheep placenta to obtain higher levels of HGH.

Something to use during luteal is defiantly PC! Its helped me greatly!

And keep reading! I know its a lot to try to wrap your brain around, but eventually it becomes very easy to understand once you familiarize yourself with everything.

Thanks kaitlyn9, that makes perfect sense. I wonder if i already have a hormonal inbalance as my period isnt always regular. My last cycle lasted 46 days, im not sure what that means though, im still reading up on that side of things, im thinking maybe not enough estrogen.

What would be classed as a lower dose of PM for luteal phase? i have got some fenugreek with each capsule containing 500mg but i know that it is not as strong as PM, so im trying to figure out what dose i should be taking that in during luteal.

I have also been reading up on PC, a lot of mixed opinions on whether or not that should be used atal, some say it can slow down any growth and make PM less effective as it makes your estrogen receptors too sensitive, some say to use every few months for a few days, others say to use it every month. I have also read that you should apply it to a different part of the body everyday when using it, is this right?

I was also thinking about purchasing the placenta, i have read a few scary things about ingesting HGH though, but then im thinking maybe this is in small doses so shouldnt cause too many issues, i need to read up abit more about it before i can decide for sure though.

Sorry if i am bombarding you with all these questions, im slowly trying to wrap my head around as much info as possible and learn as much as i can. I feel like i could sit and read this forum allday long. haha!

[Kaitlyn Kitten]

FG is not nearly as strong as PM so that's a safe bet for luteal. Or you could just take small amount of PM. I sometimes open up the capsules and take half of the powder.

Ive never heard of PC stopping growth unless your progesterone dominate.

You really need to figure out what kinda of hormone imbalances you may have; It sounds like you do because of the 46 day long cycle your having. And yes, you need to apply it to different part of the body. Preferably places less fatty places with veins present, i.e., wrists, inside of arms, chest, breasts, ankles.

For me personally its been helpful, but Im low estrogen with even lower progesterone so I react well to it.

[MissT22]

It's all so confusing

[AbiDrew85]

FG is not nearly as strong as PM so that's a safe bet for luteal. Or you could just take small amount of PM. I sometimes open up the capsules and take half of the powder.

Ive never heard of PC stopping growth unless your progesterone dominate.

You really need to figure out what kinda of hormone imbalances you may have; It sounds like you do because of the 46 day long cycle your having. And yes, you need to apply it to different part of the body. Preferably places less fatty places with veins present, i.e., wrists, inside of arms, chest, breasts, ankles.

For me personally its been helpful, but Im low estrogen with even lower progesterone so I react well to it.

LOL. It's not that FG isn't as "strong" as PM, it's that it's doing something completely different! It's comparing apples to oranges. FG is a VERY strong apple, and PM is a VERY STRONG orange... Let's say Fuji and Nectarine.

PM is an estrogen. The second or third strongest. The strongest of course being estradiol, e2, the dominant natural female estrogen. It's also an anti-androgen, though the strength of that activity is hotly debated over in the men's area.

FG is a prolactin/galactagogue and an adaptogen that shuts off certain parts of the negative feedback mechanisms in your bodies hormonal synthesis pathway. In other words it makes your body think its pregnant for the most part. If you respond to FG in ways that make your think you're pregnant, you probably aren't, congratulations, you're responding as intended.

Of course if you fiddle around with the FG you can pull off some interesting tricks compared to a constant dose. Constant dose is how you imitate pregnancy.

In fact... FG first drew our attention (NBE'ers) due to its use by some women during and shortly after pregnancy to enhance their milk production because they weren't making enough on their own for whatever reason.

[Sammy95]

FG is not nearly as strong as PM so that's a safe bet for luteal. Or you could just take small amount of PM. I sometimes open up the capsules and take half of the powder.

Ive never heard of PC stopping growth unless your progesterone dominate.

You really need to figure out what kinda of hormone imbalances you may have; It sounds like you do because of the 46 day long cycle your having. And yes, you need to apply it to different part of the body. Preferably places less fatty places with veins present, i.e., wrists, inside of arms, chest, breasts, ankles.

For me personally its been helpful, but Im low estrogen with even lower progesterone so I react well to it.

Thanks kaitlyn9, sorry for the late reply i havent had a chance to get on here much the last few days. My doctor sent me for a blood test to check all my hormone levels, i did ask for the saliva test but she said she wanted to do bloods (ive heard the saliva one is best) but this is all she would offer me so im hoping it may atleast give me an idea as to what my hormone levels are etc...

I am still waiting for my PM to arrive, have you ever ordered from Ainterol.co.uk atal? according to the tracking it has been shipped but that's all it says......just hoping it arrives soon!!! Until then i will continue with the FG. At the minute i am taking 1000mg, but i have read on another thread people taking as much as 3-4000mg and that is alongside PM, that sounds like an awful lot to me, on the bottle it says to take 1-2 capules which would equal 500-1000mg. what would a recommended dose be for NBE? any ideas would be great!

I have my PC cream, it says on the bottle to apply twice a day but i have been reading that that can be too much and can throw your hormones off but i am not sure, any recommendations? I may wait and see what my bloods come back as and take it from there.

Thanks again for all your help!!

[Sammy95]

[quote='kaitlyn9' pid='78268' dateline='1373318114']

FG is a prolactin/galactagogue and an adaptogen that shuts off certain parts of the negative feedback mechanisms in your bodies hormonal synthesis pathway. In other words it makes your body think its pregnant for the most part. If you respond to FG in ways that make your think you're pregnant, you probably aren't, congratulations, you're responding as intended.

Of course if you fiddle around with the FG you can pull off some interesting tricks compared to a constant dose. Constant dose is how you imitate pregnancy.

In fact... FG first drew our attention (NBE'ers) due to its use by some women during and shortly after pregnancy to enhance their milk production because they weren't making enough on their own for whatever reason.

wow thanks AbiDrew85, thats really interesting!

so with regards to FG making your body think it is pregnant thus enhancing milk production does that not mean that any growth you may see is temporary and will simply diminish once you stop taking FG?

Also what kind of interesting tricks can be created and on what kind of doses are we talking? i am always interested in hearing other peoples theories and experiences, it's all really fascinating to me what we can do to our bodies simply taking various combinations of these herbs!!

Any advice would be great. At the moment i am simply taking 500mg of FG twice a day, along with calcium+vit D, hair skin and nails, and ginkgo. Still awaiting my PM at the moment.

[Sammy95]

FG is not nearly as strong as PM so that's a safe bet for luteal. Or you could just take small amount of PM. I sometimes open up the capsules and take half of the powder.

Ive never heard of PC stopping growth unless your progesterone dominate.

You really need to figure out what kinda of hormone imbalances you may have; It sounds like you do because of the 46 day long cycle your having. And yes, you need to apply it to different part of the body. Preferably places less fatty places with veins present, i.e., wrists, inside of arms, chest, breasts, ankles.

For me personally its been helpful, but Im low estrogen with even lower progesterone so I react well to it.

LOL. It's not that FG isn't as "strong" as PM, it's that it's doing something completely different! It's comparing apples to oranges. FG is a VERY strong apple, and PM is a VERY STRONG orange... Let's say Fuji and Nectarine.

PM is an estrogen. The second or third strongest. The strongest of course being estradiol, e2, the dominant natural female estrogen. It's also an anti-androgen, though the strength of that activity is hotly debated over in the men's area.

FG is a prolactin/galactagogue and an adaptogen that shuts off certain parts of the negative feedback mechanisms in your bodies hormonal synthesis pathway. In other words it makes your body think its pregnant for the most part. If you respond to FG in ways that make your think you're pregnant, you probably aren't, congratulations, you're responding as intended.

Of course if you fiddle around with the FG you can pull off some interesting tricks compared to a constant dose. Constant dose is how you imitate pregnancy.

In fact... FG first drew our attention (NBE'ers) due to its use by some women during and shortly after pregnancy to enhance their milk production because they weren't making enough on their own for whatever reason.

wow thanks AbiDrew85, thats really interesting!

so with regards to FG making your body think it is pregnant thus enhancing milk production does that not mean that any growth you may see is temporary and will simply diminish once you stop taking FG?

Also what kind of interesting tricks can be created and on what kind of doses are we talking? i am always interested in hearing other peoples theories and experiences, it's all really fascinating to me what we can do to our bodies simply taking various combinations of these herbs!!

Any advice would be great. At the moment i am simply taking 500mg of FG twice a day, along with calcium+vit D, hair skin and nails, and ginkgo. Still awaiting my PM at the moment.

[AbiDrew85]

so with regards to FG making your body think it is pregnant thus enhancing milk production does that not mean that any growth you may see is temporary and will simply diminish once you stop taking FG?

It's possible. It's possible you could keep at least some of it. Or you might "deflate" like a balloon. You might even get lucky and keep all your gains... It's really a little less exact than we might wish sometimes. I've heard of all three situations happening.

Also what kind of interesting tricks can be created and on what kind of doses are we talking? i am always interested in hearing other peoples theories and experiences, it's all really fascinating to me what we can do to our bodies simply taking various combinations of these herbs!!

Well, what I'm doing with it is taking a lowered dose 2 weeks out of 4, then the "recommended" dose for 12 days of the remaining 2 weeks, 6 days either end of my peak dosing for 2 days that's right in the middle.

This is basically part of my imitating the monthly cycle... I'm an MtF btw, thus why I'd want to imitate a cycle.

There are three hormones that rise and fall through the month in the average female: estrogen, prolactin, and progesterone. Estrogen rises twice in a cycle, to a sharp peak mid-month when you ovulate, then falls immediately after very rapidly, to slowly rise again before slowly falling again before menses. Progesterone rises and falls only during the last two weeks of a cycle, with minimal amounts the rest of the month. Prolactin otoh rises to a peak at ovulation and then falls the rest of the month. It's a slow rise, and a slow fall, and it never really goes down to a "minimal".

Something else that someone could do is slowly increase it and then stop completely. This would more closely resemble a random prolactin surge that some girls experience late in puberty. I intend to do that eventually later in my development. I've only been going at this less than a year. And I won't really "stop completely", but rather I'll slowly increase my doses to double my present peak dose over the course of a month, and then suddenly drop back to my low dose. I might do this a few times during my development... Once a year maybe at random times.